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Dr. Howard Dean
THE CANDIDATES WITH DAVID YEPSEN #2409>> FUNDING FOR THIS PROGRAM WAS PROVIDED BY "FRIENDS," THE IOWA PUBLIC TELEVISION FOUNDATION... GENERATIONS OF FAMILIES AND FRIENDS WHO FEEL PASSIONATE ABOUT THE PROGRAMS THEY WATCH ON IOWA PUBLIC TELEVISION. FROM THE STUDIOS OF IOWA PUBLIC TELEVISION, THIS IS "THE CANDIDATES WITH DAVID YEPSEN." TONIGHT DAVID YEPSEN'S GUEST IS DR. HOWARD DEAN OF VERMONT, CANDIDATE FOR THE DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENTIAL NOMINATION. HERE IS "DES MOINES REGISTER" POLITICAL COLUMNIST, DAVID YEPSEN. Yepsen: GOOD EVENING. TONIGHT WE'RE INVOLVED IN THE NINTH PROGRAM IN OUR TEN-PART SERIES HIGHLIGHTING THE IOWA CAUCUSES OF 2004, AND WE'RE INVOLVED IN POLITICAL CONVERSATIONS WITH THE CANDIDATES AND WITH THE PEOPLE WHO FOLLOW THE PROCESS. WITHOUT QUESTION, THE CANDIDACY OF GOVERNOR HOWARD DEAN HAS BEEN THE BIG STORY, AND A SURPRISE STORY AT THAT, IN THE ELECTION CYCLE OF 2004. LATE LAST SPRING THE FORMER GOVERNOR OF VERMONT SHOT OUT OF THE CROWDED FIELD OF DEMOCRATIC CONTENDERS, MOVING FROM THE CATEGORY OF UNKNOWN TO THE STATUS OF FRONT-RUNNER, THANKS LARGELY TO HIS OPPOSITION TO THE IRAQ WAR. AND NOW HE'S BROUGHT NEWCOMERS INTO THE POLITICAL PROCESS. THAT MEANS THERE ARE MANY FIRST-TIME CAUCUS PARTICIPANTS IN THE DEAN CAMP. THEY LIKE HIS NO-NONSENSE, TELL-IT-LIKE-IT-IS CAMPAIGN STYLE. AND OUT ON THE STUMP, IT LEAVES NO DOUBT WHERE THE CANDIDATE STANDS ON THE ISSUES. BUT THERE ARE TWO SIDES TO THAT COIN, HOWEVER, AS DEAN'S UP-FRONT STYLE HAS MADE HIM THE TARGET OF THE GOP AND HIS DEMOCRATIC RIVALS AS WELL. GOVERNOR DEAN, WELCOME TO IOWA PUBLIC TELEVISION. Dean: THANKS, DAVID. THANKS FOR HAVING ME ON. Yepsen: WELL, EDGE OF THE NEWS, GOVERNOR, ON WEDNESDAY, SPEAKING OF YOUR OPPONENTS' ATTACKS, RICHARD GEPHARDT SAID ALL OF YOUR GAFFES REALLY AREN'T GAFFES, THAT YOU'RE A BLUNT TALKER, THAT YOU MEAN EVERYTHING YOU SAY. AND HE SAID THAT YOU ARE A MAN OF "FALSE CONVICTION" AND "THAT YOU CAN'T BE TRUSTED." A PRETTY SERIOUS CHARGE. Dean: YEAH, YOU KNOW, I THINK IT'S SORT OF A SAD COMMENTARY ON DICK GEPHARDT. I WORKED FOR DICK GEPHARDT IN '88. HE'S A GOOD GUY BUT WHAT THIS IS ABOUT IS POWER. AND WHAT I REPRESENT IS A NEW GROUP OF PEOPLE COMING IN TO TAKE THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY BACK SO THAT WE CAN STAND UP TO PRESIDENT BUSH AND A NEW GROUP OF PEOPLE WHO WANT TO TAKE THIS COUNTRY BACK. DICK GEPHARDT IS PART OF THE OLD PROBLEM. SO ARE SOME OF THE OTHER FOLKS. THEY'RE ALL GOOD PEOPLE, BUT THEY'RE WASHINGTON PEOPLE. LET'S JUST NOT -- LET'S NOT BE -- KID OURSELVES ABOUT THIS. THESE GUYS ARE LOOKING AT THE END OF THEIR CAREERS IF I WIN, AND THEY'RE GOING TO DO ANYTHING THEY CAN TO STOP ME. BUT THEY'RE NOT TRYING TO STOP ME; THEY'RE TRYING TO STOP US, BECAUSE THERE ARE HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF PEOPLE WHO HAVE PINNED THEIR HOPES TO A NEW FACE IN THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY WHO WILL STAND UP TO GEORGE BUSH WHEN THEY WOULDN'T. THEY WOULDN'T STAND UP TO HIM ON THE WAR. THEY WOULDN'T STAND UP TO HIM ON THE NO CHILD LEFT BEHIND. WHEN THE PRESIDENT WANTED $1.2 TRILLION WORTH OF TAX CUTS, THEY SAID, "OH, NO, IT SHOULD ONLY BE $900 BILLION." WE NEED A DIFFERENT KIND OF DEMOCRATIC PARTY. WE NEED TO GET BACK TO THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY ROOTS, AND THAT'S WHAT WE'VE DONE. Yepsen: GOVERNOR, ANOTHER THING THAT'S COME UP HERE IN THE NEWS LATELY IS YOU'RE APPARENTLY SCHEDULED TO GO DOWN TO GEORGIA TO MEET WITH PRESIDENT CARTER ON SUNDAY. SOME PEOPLE ARE CONCERNED THAT YOU'RE TAKING YOUR EYE OFF THE BALL HERE IN IOWA. ARE YOU GETTING A LITTLE OVERCONFIDENT ABOUT YOUR POSITION IN IOWA THAT YOU'D BREAK OFF FROM THE CAMPAIGN JUST A FEW DAYS AWAY? Dean: NO, WE THOUGHT ABOUT THAT A LOT. AND, YOU KNOW, WE'VE WORKED REALLY HARD IN IOWA. I'VE BEEN HERE PROBABLY MORE THAN ANY OTHER CANDIDATE, CERTAINLY LONGER THAN ANY OTHER CANDIDATE. I'VE BEEN IN ALL 99 COUNTIES. DID THAT IN OCTOBER. BUT WHEN THE FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES ASKS YOU TO GO TO CHURCH WITH HIM ON THE SUNDAY BEFORE CAUCUSES, I THINK YOU PROBABLY TAKE THAT UP. JIMMY CARTER IS SOMEBODY I ADMIRE GREATLY. JIMMY CARTER WAS THE LAST PERSON WHO TOOK IOWA SERIOUSLY, AS I HAVE. HE CAME OUT HERE. IOWANS MADE JIMMY CARTER THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES. SO I'M VERY MUCH HOPING THAT SINCE WE'VE WORKED THE WAY -- AS HARD AS JIMMY CARTER DID -- AND I ACTUALLY WENT DOWN TO GEORGIA TO SEE HIM LONG AGO AND ASKED HIM HOW HE DID IT IN IOWA -- THAT PEOPLE WON'T THINK I'M TAKING OFF FROM THE CAUCUSES. THEY'LL THINK THAT I'M, JUST THE DAY BEFORE, GOING BACK TO MY ROOTS. AND I'M NOT ACTUALLY GOING TO MISS ONE DAY OF CAMPAIGNING. I'M GOING TO FLY OUT SATURDAY NIGHT, AND I'LL BE BACK HERE SUNDAY. SO IT'S A LITTLE TIME OFF, BUT TO THE FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES, HOW CAN YOU SAY NO? Yepsen: SURE. JIMMY CARTER, THAT'S NOT ALL BAD IN IOWA. HE TAUGHT A LOT OF US TO PAY ATTENTION TO UNEMPLOYED FORMER GOVERNORS FROM SMALLER STATES. Dean: THAT'S RIGHT. Yepsen: WHAT DID HE TELL YOU ABOUT HOW TO DO IOWA? Dean: JUST WORK HARD. HE SAID WORK HARD AND ALWAYS SHOW THAT YOU'RE ABSOLUTELY DETERMINED TO WIN AND THAT YOU WILL WIN. Yepsen: GOVERNOR, I WANT TO GIVE YOU A FREE THROW HERE. GIVE US YOUR CAMPAIGN COMMERCIAL. WHY DO YOU WANT TO BE PRESIDENT? Dean: BECAUSE I'M DIFFERENT THAN ALL THE OTHER CANDIDATES. I DON'T THINK THIS COUNTRY IS IN VERY GOOD SHAPE RIGHT NOW: HALF-A-TRILLION-DOLLAR DEFICITS; HEALTH INSURANCE THAT WAS PROMISED BY HARRY TRUMAN, BUT FIFTY-SIX YEARS LATER, THROUGH BOTH DEMOCRATIC AND REPUBLICAN ADMINISTRATIONS, NO HEALTH INSURANCE FOR ALL AMERICANS; JOBS GOING OUT THE DOOR BECAUSE OF NAFTA AND THE WTO AND BECAUSE WE'RE NOT INVESTING IN SMALL BUSINESSES IN THIS COUNTRY. THE ONE ADVANTAGE I HAVE IN THIS RACE IS THAT I'M A GOVERNOR. THEY ALL TALK ABOUT HEALTH INSURANCE. I'VE DONE IT. EVERY FOUR YEARS THEY TALK ABOUT THINGS LIKE BALANCING THE BUDGET. I'M THE ONLY ONE THAT'S EVER BALANCED A BUDGET IN THIS ENTIRE RACE. BUT THE MOST IMPORTANT THING IS WE NEED TO CHANGE THIS COUNTRY. WE'RE NOT GOING TO BEAT GEORGE BUSH BY BEING "BUSH LIGHT," BY VOTING FOR THE WAR BECAUSE WE'RE AFRAID OF HIS POLL RATINGS, BY VOTING FOR NO CHILD LEFT BEHIND BECAUSE WE'RE AFRAID OF BEING CALLED ANTIEDUCATION. AND WHAT I DID OVER A YEAR AGO WHEN NOBODY ELSE WOULD DO IT IS TO STAND UP TO THIS PRESIDENT AND SAY, NO, IT IS NOT UNPATRIOTIC TO DISAGREE WITH A PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES. Yepsen: THERE ARE A LOT OF UNDECIDED CAUCUS GOERS STILL, EVEN THOUGH VOTING IS JUST A FEW DAYS AWAY. TALK TO THEM. WHY SHOULD AN UNDECIDED IOWA DEMOCRAT STAND UP FOR YOU ON CAUCUS NIGHT? Dean: WHAT UNDECIDED DEMOCRATS CARE THE MOST ABOUT IS WHO CAN BEAT GEORGE BUSH. THERE'S NOT ONE OTHER CANDIDATE IN THIS RACE THAT'S BRINGING ANYBODY NEW INTO THE PARTY. WE'RE NOT GOING TO BEAT GEORGE BUSH WITH THE SAME OLD GROUP OF PEOPLE THAT WE'VE HAD. THEY'RE HARD WORKING PEOPLE BUT WE'RE GETTING OLDER EVERY YEAR. A QUARTER OF ALL THE PEOPLE WHO GAVE US MONEY WERE UNDER THIRTY YEARS OLD. YOU'RE GOING TO SEE, I THINK, THOUSANDS OF NEW CAUCUS GOERS HERE. I WAS AT A MEETING WE ASKED OF LEADERS, OF PRECINCT CAPTAINS AND SO FORTH. HALF THE PEOPLE HAD NEVER BEEN INVOLVED IN CAUCUSES BEFORE. WE CAN'T BEAT GEORGE BUSH WITH THE SAME DEMOCRATIC PARTY THAT WE HAD IN 2000. THE ONLY WAY TO BEAT HIM IS TO BRING NEW PEOPLE INTO THE PARTY, AND NO OTHER CANDIDATES ARE DOING THAT. Yepsen: GOVERNOR, WHAT MAKES YOU THINK YOU CAN BRING IN ENOUGH NEW PEOPLE TO WIN A PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION? YOU KNOW, IT'S ONE THING TO BRING A FEW THOUSAND PEOPLE INTO THE CAUCUS PROCESS AND WIN A CAUCUS, BUT WHY DO YOU THINK YOU CAN BRING IN MILLIONS OF NEW PEOPLE TO WIN THE WHITE HOUSE? Dean: BECAUSE AMERICANS ARE HURTING. SOUTH CAROLINA, LET'S LOOK AT. YOU KNOW, THE PRESIDENT ALWAYS RAISES THESE SOCIAL ISSUES IN SOUTH CAROLINA. HE TALKS ABOUT RACE, ALL THESE COMPLICATED ISSUES THAT PEOPLE FEEL STRONGLY ABOUT. WELL, THE TRUTH IS THAT THERE ARE A LOT OF PEOPLE LOSING THEIR JOBS IN SOUTH CAROLINA, AND THEY'RE BOTH BLACK AND WHITE. EVERYBODY NEEDS A JOB. THE TRUTH IS A LOT OF KIDS HAVE LOST THEIR HEALTH INSURANCE. HALF A MILLION KIDS UNDER PRESIDENT BUSH HAVE LOST THEIR HEALTH INSURANCE. THAT'S BLACK KIDS, BROWN KIDS, AND WHITE KIDS. WHAT I WANT TO DO IS REACH OUT TO PEOPLE WHO HAVE GIVEN UP ON THE POLITICAL PROCESS BECAUSE THEY DON'T THINK THERE'S ANY DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE DEMOCRATS AND THE REPUBLICANS, BRING THEM BACK INTO THE PROCESS, AND GIVE THEM A REASON TO HOPE AGAIN. Yepsen: TELL US A LITTLE BIT ABOUT YOURSELF, GOVERNOR. I WANT TO TURN OUR CONVERSATION TO YOU PERSONALLY. WHO IS HOWARD DEAN? Dean: WELL, I'M A DOCTOR. I'M A FATHER. I HAVE A NINETEEN YEAR OLD AND A SEVENTEEN YEAR OLD, WHICH IS WHY MY HAIR IS WHITE. IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH POLITICS. MY WIFE IS ALSO A DOCTOR, AND SHE IS MAKING AN HONEST LIVING BEING A DOCTOR. HER PATIENTS LOVE HER AND SHE'S GOOD AT IT AND SHE'S STAYING HOME WITH MY SEVENTEEN-YEAR-OLD HIGH SCHOOL SENIOR. AND I'M A FORMER GOVERNOR. AND WE DID A LOT OF GOOD THINGS WHEN I WAS GOVERNOR: BALANCED THE BUDGET; HEALTH INSURANCE FOR ALL OUR KIDS. AND NOW I'D LIKE TO DO THAT FOR THE REST OF THE COUNTRY. Yepsen: WHAT'S BEEN THE MOST FORMATIVE EXPERIENCE IN YOUR LIFE? WHAT ONE OR TWO THINGS MADE YOU WHAT YOU ARE? Dean: PROBABLY THE MOST IMPORTANT THING I DID WAS TO GO INTO MEDICINE, OTHER THAN MARRYING MY WIFE, WHICH IS BY FAR THE BEST THING I DID, AND HAVING KIDS. BUT GOING INTO MEDICINE REALLY CHANGED MY LIFE. IT MADE ME SEE THE SUFFERING THAT OTHER PEOPLE HAVE TO GO THROUGH, SOMETIMES THROUGH NO FAULT OF THEIR OWN. IT TAUGHT ME A GREAT DEAL ABOUT LIFE AND DEATH DECISIONS. IT TAUGHT ME THAT IT WAS VERY IMPORTANT NOT GET EXCITED AT DIFFICULT TIMES, BECAUSE THAT'S WHEN YOU REALLY HAD TO FOCUS THE MOST ON THE THINGS THAT REALLY MATTERED. YOU KNOW, I SAW A NINE-YEAR-OLD GET SHOT IN A DRIVE-BY SHOOTING ONE TIME AND, YOU KNOW, I WAS A MEDICAL STUDENT. I JUST SORT OF -- I WAS SO EMPATHETIC AND SO WORRIED AND SO CONCERNED THAT IF I'D BEEN THE DOCTOR, I'M NOT SURE I COULD HAVE TAKEN CARE OF THAT CHILD PROPERLY. YOU'VE GOT TO HAVE A DISTANCE, BUT YOU'VE GOT TO BE INVOLVED AT THE SAME TIME. AND I'VE LEARNED THE BALANCE AND HOW TO DO THAT. I ALSO -- IT AFFECTS MY POLITICS BECAUSE FACTS MATTER TO ME. IT'S ONE OF THE THINGS I'M REALLY UPSET ABOUT, ABOUT THE BUSH ADMINISTRATION. IF THEY HAVE A THEORY AND A FACT AND THEY DON'T COINCIDE, THEY GET RID OF THE FACT INSTEAD OF THE THEORY, AND THAT'S NOT WHAT YOU'RE TAUGHT TO DO IN MEDICAL SCHOOL. Yepsen: YOU KNOW, I READ WHERE YOUR WIFE ONCE SAID THAT SHE WAS -- AS A PHYSICIAN, SHE WAS MUCH MORE ANALYTICAL AND GATHERED ALL THE INFORMATION AND THAT YOU'RE MORE DECISIVE AND GO WITH YOUR GUT. IS THAT A FAIR -- Dean: I THINK THAT'S PROBABLY TRUE. THAT'S ACTUALLY PART OF THE THINGS THAT GET ME IN TROUBLE. WHEN I TALK, I SOMETIMES SKIP FOUR SPACES BECAUSE I'M THINKING THEM AND I'M MAKING THE ASSUMPTION THAT EVERYBODY ELSE KNOWS IT WHICH, OF COURSE, IS UNREASONABLE. SO SOMETIMES I KIND OF GO ALONG THREE STEPS AND THEN SKIP FOUR BECAUSE I KNOW WHAT THEY ARE. AND I ALSO HAVE SORT OF A THINKING PROCESS GOING ON ALL THE TIME. I USED TO TELL THE STORY ABOUT WHEN I WAS IN COLLEGE THAT MY ROOMMATES WERE AMAZED AT ME BECAUSE I USED TO BE ABLE TO SIT DOWN AND WRITE A TEN-PAGE PAPER IN ONE NIGHT AND THEN OFF IT WENT. BUT, OF COURSE, THAT'S NOT REALLY WHAT WOULD GO ON. I'D READ THE STUFF AND I'D THINK ABOUT IT FOR ABOUT THREE WEEKS AND THEN I'D SIT DOWN AND WRITE THE PAPER IN ONE NIGHT. Yepsen: WHY DID YOU GO INTO POLITICS? I MEAN IT STRIKES ME YOU'RE LIVING IN VERMONT. IT'S A STATE WHERE LOTS OF PEOPLE LIKE TO LIVE. IT'S A BEAUTIFUL PLACE. YOU COULD HAVE HAD A WONDERFUL LIFE THERE, AND YOU WOULDN'T BE OUT THERE PUTTING UP WITH GUYS LIKE ME. Dean: DAVID, I AM HAVING A WONDERFUL LIFE. OVER THE LAST TWO YEARS WE'VE REALLY CHANGED A LOT OF PEOPLE'S LIVES. WE'RE GIVING PEOPLE HOPE AGAIN. PEOPLE HAVE BEEN SO DOWNTRODDEN BY THE POLITICAL PROCESS, BY THE WASHINGTON INSIDERS, THE SPECIAL INTERESTS, BY THE BELIEF THAT IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO YOU VOTE FOR ANYMORE, IT CAN'T MAKE ANY DIFFERENCE. ALL OF A SUDDEN PEOPLE HAVE HOPE AGAIN. IT'S BEEN A TREMENDOUS EXPERIENCE, A REALLY GREAT EXPERIENCE. AND I HOPE THAT WE ARE GOING TO TAKE THE WHITE HOUSE BACK BECAUSE I THINK HOPE IS ALWAYS GOING TO BEAT FEAR. Yepsen: WHAT PROMPTED YOU, THOUGH, TO LEAVE THE CAREER OF MEDICINE, TO GO INTO THE CAREER OF POLITICS? Dean: I ACTUALLY DIDN'T HAVE ANY CHOICE. I WAS LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR, WHICH IS A PART-TIME JOB, SO I WAS PRACTICING MEDICINE AND ALSO SERVING AS LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR PART TIME. AND IN AUGUST OF 1991, THE GOVERNOR DROPPED DEAD OF A HEART ATTACK AT A YOUNG AGE, ONLY 64 YEARS OLD, AND I BECAME GOVERNOR. THAT'S A FULL-TIME JOB AND THAT WAS THE END OF MY MEDICAL PRACTICE. Yepsen: YOU ARE A NONTRADITIONAL POLITICIAN AS A RESULT OF THAT. HOW WOULD BEING A PHYSICIAN AFFECT THE WAY YOU WOULD ACT IN THE WHITE HOUSE? WHAT DOES IT MEAN TO HAVE A DOCTOR PRESIDENT? Dean: WELL, FIRST OF ALL, WE'RE GOING TO HAVE HEALTH INSURANCE FOR EVERY SINGLE PERSON. EVERYBODY TALKS ABOUT IT, BUT I'LL DO IT AND I'VE DONE IT FOR ALL CHILDREN IN VERMONT AND FOR A LOT OF SENIORS, PRESCRIPTION BENEFITS AND SO FORTH. SECOND OF ALL, I LIKE TO BALANCE BUDGETS. YOU CANNOT SUCCEED AS A COUNTRY RUNNING HALF-TRILLION-DOLLAR DEFICITS EVERY YEAR. IT'S NOT GOING TO HAPPEN. AND THIRD OF ALL, I BELIEVE IN PREVENTION. WE INVEST ENORMOUS AMOUNTS OF TIME AND MONEY IN SMALL CHILDREN SO THEY WON'T END UP IN PRISON TWENTY YEARS LATER. WE'VE REDUCED OUR CHILD ABUSE RATE BY 43 PERCENT. THOSE THINGS MATTER AND THERE'S COMMON GROUND BETWEEN PROGRESSIVES AND CONSERVATIVES IN THOSE AREAS, BECAUSE THE PROGRESSIVES ALWAYS WANT TO DO IT FOR THE SAKE OF THE FAMILY. CONSERVATIVES, IF THEY THINK ABOUT IT, IF YOU WANT TO REDUCE THE BOTTOM LINE, THEN YOU'VE GOT TO LOWER THE NUMBER OF KIDS IN SOCIAL SERVICES. AND THE WAY TO DO THAT IS TO TAKE CARE OF THE BETWEEN ZERO AND THREE SO THEY DON'T NEED THOSE SOCIAL SERVICES LATER ON. PREVENTION IS EVERYTHING IN THE ENVIRONMENT. IT'S EVERYTHING WHEN YOU'RE DEALING WITH KIDS AND EDUCATION. WE DON'T DO MUCH OF IT IN THIS COUNTRY. Yepsen: WE'LL GET TO SOME OF THOSE ISSUES IN A MINUTE, GOVERNOR. ONE OF THE THINGS I LIKE TO DO WITH OUR CONVERSATIONS IS TO GIVE CANDIDATES A CHANCE TO RESPOND TO SOME OF THE NEGATIVES, ATTACKS THAT ARE THROWN AT THEM. ONE THING I HEAR FROM CAUCUS GOERS IS THEY'RE REALLY CONCERNED ABOUT THE FACT YOU WERE ENDORSED BY THE NATIONAL RIFLE ASSOCIATION SO OFTEN. THEY DON'T EXACTLY HAVE A GOOD FEEL FOR THE NRA. Dean: NO, I UNDERSTAND. Yepsen: HOW DO YOU RESPOND TO THAT? WHAT DO YOU SAY TO A CAUCUS GOER SAYING, "I KIND OF LIKE HOWARD DEAN BUT, GEE, NRA?" Dean: WELL, YOU KNOW, I COME FROM A VERY RURAL STATE WHERE THERE ARE A LOT OF HUNTERS, AND I WAS ALWAYS A VERY STRONG CONSERVATIONIST. THE NRA IN RURAL STATES IS NOT WHAT IT IS IN THE SUBURBS WHERE THEY ALL THINK THEY OUGHT TO HAVE BAZOOKAS ON THEIR FRONT LAWN. MY ATTITUDE TOWARDS GUNS IS, ONE, I BELIEVE IN THE ASSAULT WEAPONS BAN. I BELIEVE IN THE BRADY BILL. I BELIEVE THAT WE OUGHT TO HAVE BACKGROUND CHECKS AT GUN SHOWS. BUT THAT'S THE LAW, EXCEPT FOR THE BACKGROUND CHECKS, WHICH WE OUGHT TO HAVE. AND THEY OUGHT TO BE DONE BY INSTANT CHECK, WHICH MEANS YOU DON'T -- YOU KNOW, THE COMPUTER COMES BACK AND SAYS IF YOU HAVE A CRIMINAL RECORD OR NOT. I'VE YET TO MEET A HUNTER WHO THINKS YOU NEED AN AK47 TO SHOOT A DEER OR THINKS THAT CRIMINALS OUGHT TO GET THEIR HANDS ON GUNS. AFTER THAT ENFORCE THOSE FEDERAL LAWS AND LET STATES MAKE ADDITIONAL LAWS IF THEY WANT TO. NOW, THE NRA IS NOT GOING TO ENDORSE ME IN THE GENERAL ELECTION. BUT, FRANKLY, IN THE GENERAL ELECTION, PROBABLY I WON'T GET AS MUCH FLAK AS SOME OF THE OTHER DEMOCRATS WILL. WE'VE GOT TO GET THIS ISSUE OFF THE TABLE AS A NATIONAL ISSUE BECAUSE IT'S NOT A NATIONAL ISSUE. WE OUGHT TO HAVE THE FEDERAL LAWS THAT KEEP GUNS OUT OF THE HANDS OF CRIMINALS, AND THEN AFTER THAT, IF A STATE LIKE CALIFORNIA OR NEW JERSEY OR MICHIGAN WANTS MORE GUN CONTROL, LET THEM HAVE IT. IF THEY'RE LIKE VERMONT OR MONTANA AND ARIZONA, THEN FINE, JUST ENFORCE THE FEDERAL LAWS VIGOROUSLY. THAT'S MY POSITION. Yepsen: THE OTHER CRITICISM THAT GETS MADE OF YOU, GOVERNOR, IS THAT YOU'RE REALLY INEXPERIENCED ON THE NATIONAL STAGE, THAT YOU HAVE NO SIGNIFICANT FOREIGN POLICY EXPERIENCE, AND THAT THAT MAY BE IMPORTANT TO THE NEXT PRESIDENT. HOW DO YOU RESPOND TO THAT? Dean: I'VE HAD AS MUCH FOREIGN POLICY EXPERIENCE AS JIMMY CARTER OR BILL CLINTON AND RONALD REAGAN. AND LET ME JUST SAY THIS: JOHN EDWARDS, JOHN KERRY, WES CLARK, JOE LIEBERMAN, DICK GEPHARDT, ALL VOTED FOR THE WAR. I DIDN'T. WE HAD THE SAME SET OF FACTS. I LOOKED AT THOSE FACTS AND I SAID EVEN THOUGH I SUPPORTED THE FIRST IRAQ WAR, THE AFGHANISTAN WAR, BOSNIA, AND KOSOVO, THIS DOESN'T MAKE SENSE. IT TURNED OUT I WAS RIGHT. THOSE GUYS DID NOT HAVE THE COURAGE TO STAND UP AND CONFRONT THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES WHEN IT DIDN'T ADD UP. IT WAS BEFORE AN ELECTION. THEY WANTED TO GET IT OFF THE TABLE. WHAT YOU GET WITH ME, DAVID, IS PATIENCE AND JUDGMENT. YOU KNOW, PRESIDENTS -- INEXPERIENCED PRESIDENTS HAVE BEEN PRESIDENT BEFORE. NOW, THE TRUTH IS AS A GOVERNOR, I'VE MADE A LOT TOUGHER DECISIONS THAN THEY EVER HAD TO MAKE IN THE LEGISLATURE. WASHINGTON IS ABOUT THE ONLY CITY IN THE COUNTRY WHERE SITTING ON A COMMITTEE QUALIFIES AS BEING EXPERIENCED. WHAT I CAN BRING TO YOU IS TOUGHNESS AND THE WILLINGNESS TO STAND UP AND SAY WHAT I THINK IS RIGHT. I DID THAT A YEAR AGO WHEN NO ONE ELSE WAS WILLING TO DO IT, AND I'LL DO IT AS PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES TO STAND UP TO THE SPECIAL INTERESTS. Yepsen: GOVERNOR, LET'S TURN OUR ATTENTION TO SOME OF THE ISSUES IN THE CAMPAIGN. THERE ARE WAY TOO MANY, BUT LET'S TOUCH ON A FEW OF THE MAJOR ONES. IRAQ, WHERE DO WE GO FROM HERE? Dean: WE HAVE AN ELECTION TO HAVE AN IRAQI COUNCIL THAT THE IRAQI PEOPLE FEEL IS REPRESENTATIVE OF THEM. WE DRAFT A CONSTITUTION, MUCH LIKE THE PROCESS IN AFGHANISTAN, WHICH HAS WORKED REASONABLY WELL. AND THEN WE BRING IN FOREIGN SOLDIERS, AT LEAST 100,000 OF THEM, AS PRESIDENT BUSH'S FATHER WAS ABLE TO DO, BY RECONSTITUTING OUR ALLIANCE -- OUR ALLIANCES, WHICH ARE CRITICAL, WHICH WE CAN ONLY DO IF WE REPLACE THIS PRESIDENT, AND THEN BY BRINGING OUR GUARD AND RESERVE HOME -- TROOPS HOME FIRST, WHICH HAVE NO BUSINESS BEING IN IRAQ FOR THIS KIND OF LENGTH OF TIME. AND THEN ONE OF THE TWO DIVISIONS; WE NEED TO TURN THIS INTO AN INTERNATIONAL OCCUPATION -- AN INTERNATIONAL RECONSTRUCTION, NOT AN AMERICAN OCCUPATION. Yepsen: WHAT DO YOU DO ABOUT THE ECONOMY? HOW DO WE GET THAT GOING AGAIN? Dean: WE DO SEVERAL THINGS. WE CHANGE NAFTA AND THE WTO. WE'VE GLOBALIZED THE RIGHTS OF MULTINATIONAL CORPORATIONS, WHICH I WAS IN FAVOR OF BECAUSE I THOUGHT IT WOULD LEAD TO MORE STABLE DEMOCRACIES IN OTHER PARTS OF THE WORLD, BUT WE DID NOT GLOBALIZE -- THE MISTAKE WAS MADE. WE DID NOT GLOBALIZE LABOR RIGHTS, ENVIRONMENTAL RIGHTS, AND HUMAN RIGHTS. IF WE DON'T DO THAT, NAFTA DOESN'T WORK. NAFTA IS SUCKING JOBS OF THE UNITED STATES' MID SECTION LIKE CRAZY. WE'VE GOT TO STOP THAT. THE WAY TO DO IT IS TO GIVE LABOR UNIONS THE RIGHTS TO ORGANIZE ELSEWHERE, INCREASE THE STANDARD OF LIVING LIKE WAS DONE HERE A HUNDRED YEARS AGO. AND THAT WILL STOP, (A) JOBS FROM GOING OUT OF THE UNITED STATES, AND (B) IT WILL REDUCE ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION, BECAUSE PEOPLE WILL NOW HAVE UPWARD MOBILITY IN THEIR OWN COUNTRY. THAT'S NUMBER ONE. NUMBER TWO, WE'VE GOT TO BALANCE THE BUDGET. NOBODY ELSE SEEMS TO BE WILLING TO DO THAT BECAUSE THEY'VE NEVER DONE IT BEFORE. WE'VE GOT TO DO THAT. PEOPLE DON'T INVEST IN COUNTRIES THAT RUN HALF-TRILLION-DOLLAR DEFICITS EVERY SINGLE YEAR. THREE, WE'VE GOT TO HELP SMALL BUSINESS. SMALL BUSINESS CREATES 70 PERCENT OF ALL THE NEW JOBS IN AMERICA, AND THOSE JOBS DON'T LEAVE THEIR COMMUNITIES. FOUR, WE'VE GOT TO INVEST IN AMERICA: ROADS, SCHOOLS, BRIDGES, RENEWABLE ENERGY, BROADBAND TELECOMMUNICATIONS. THAT KIND OF INVESTMENT CREATES JOBS NOW, BUT IT ALSO REBUILDS THE INFRASTRUCTURE SO WE CAN HAVE MORE JOBS LATER. Yepsen: BALANCED BUDGET, TALK MORE ABOUT THAT. WHAT TAXES DO YOU RAISE? WHAT PROGRAMS DO YOU CUT? HOW LONG DOES IT TAKE? Dean: YOU GET RID OF THE BUSH TAX CUT. THAT'S $3 TRILLION. SOME OF MY OPPONENTS HAVE CRITICIZED ME FOR SAYING THAT, BUT THE TRUTH IS MIDDLE-CLASS PEOPLE DIDN'T GET A TAX CUT. THEY GOT $304 AND THEIR COLLEGE TUITIONS WERE DRIVEN UP BECAUSE THE PRESIDENT CUT PELL GRANTS. THEIR HEALTH INSURANCE COSTS WERE DRIVEN UP BECAUSE THE PRESIDENT CUT A MILLION AND A HALF AMERICANS OFF HEALTH INSURANCE. THEIR COLLEGE TUITIONS WERE DRIVEN UP -- EXCUSE ME, THEIR PROPERTY TAXES WERE DRIVEN UP BECAUSE THE PRESIDENT WOULDN'T FUND SPECIAL EDUCATION, NO CHILD LEFT BEHIND. SO THERE WAS NO MIDDLE-CLASS TAX CUT. I SAY GET RID OF THE $3-TRILLION TAX CUT. THAT GOES A LONG WAY TO BALANCING THE BUDGET. OUT OF THAT, YOU CAN PAY FOR HEALTH INSURANCE, FUND SPECIAL EDUCATION, DO SOME THINGS FOR HIGHER EDUCATION, AND A COUPLE OF OTHER SMALLER PROGRAMS, AND STILL HAVE MONEY LEFT OVER. I BELIEVE THAT WE CAN BALANCE THE BUDGET IN THIS COUNTRY IN SIX TO SEVEN YEARS, AND STILL HAVE MIDDLE -- AND STILL CHANGE THE TAX CODE SO IT'S MORE FAIR TO MIDDLE-CLASS PEOPLE. BUT WE DO HAVE TO BALANCE THE BUDGET, AND NOBODY ELSE IN THE RACE SEEMS TO BE INTERESTED IN DOING THAT. Yepsen: YOU'VE TALKED ABOUT GETTING RID OF THE BUSH TAX CUTS AND THEN DOING SOMETHING FOR THE MIDDLE CLASS, BUT YOU HAVEN'T REALLY LAID OUT ALL THE DETAILS. Dean: WE CAN'T LAY OUT THE DETAILS YET. Yepsen: WHY NOT? Dean: BECAUSE WE DON'T KNOW WHAT THEY ARE. BALANCING THE BUDGET COMES FIRST. I'VE SAID I WAS GOING TO CHANGE THE TAX CODE. WE'RE LOOKING AT THE PAYROLL TAX, WHICH IS THE MOST REGRESSIVE AND THE LEAST FAVORABLE TAX. WE'D HAVE TO GIVE TAX CREDITS FOR THAT BECAUSE YOU CAN'T TAKE THE MONEY OUT OF THE SOCIAL SECURITY TRUST FUND. SO WE DON'T KNOW YET WHAT WE'RE GOING TO DO, BUT MY PRIORITY IS TO BALANCE THE BUDGET. WE HAVE TO BALANCE THE BUDGET. IF WE DON'T, OUR GRANDCHILDREN ARE GOING TO PAY THE BILL. Yepsen: I HAVE TO ASK YOU A POINTED QUESTION. ISN'T THAT ASKING A LOT OF IOWA CAUCUS GOERS MAYBE TO BUY A PIG AND A POKE? Dean: WELL, NOT REALLY. I MEAN I'M THE ONLY ONE THAT'S EVER BALANCED A BUDGET. I'M THE ONLY ONE THAT'S DELIVERED HEALTH INSURANCE. I'D SAY THERE ARE A WHOLE LOT MORE PIGS AND POKES IN THE OTHER CANDIDATES' CAMPS THAN THERE ARE IN MINE. I MEAN THIS IS WHAT'S THE MATTER WITH WASHINGTON, THOUGH. THIS IS WHY I'M RUNNING FOR PRESIDENT. WHEN AL GORE WAS DEFEATED, HE HAD 500,000 MORE VOTES THAN GEORGE BUSH. OUR GUYS IN WASHINGTON, INCLUDING DICK GEPHARDT AND JOHN EDWARDS AND JOHN KERRY, ALL GOOD PEOPLE, TREATED GEORGE BUSH AS IF HE HAD A FIVE-MILLION VOTE PLURALITY. THEY VOTED FOR THE STUFF THAT HE ASKED THEM TO. THAT IS NOT THE ROLE OF THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY. THE ROLE OF THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY IS TO PUSH AN AGENDA THAT'S GOOD FOR AMERICA, NOT THE AGENDA THAT'S GOOD FOR THE RIGHT WING OF THE REPUBLICAN PARTY. SO THEY KEEP SAYING -- NOW THEY COME TO IOWA. I SAW JOHN EDWARDS SWITCHED HIS POSITION ON HOG LOTS. HE VOTED AGAINST BANNING PACKERS FROM OWNING LOTS. NOW HE'S IN FAVOR OF IT. THAT'S FINE. I DON'T MIND HIM SWITCHING. BUT THE PROBLEM IS THEY ALL TALK WHEN THEY COME OUT HERE AND WANT IOWANS' VOTES. I COME OUT HERE AND SAY HERE'S MY RECORD. I DID HEALTH INSURANCE FOR EVERY KID. I'LL DO IT FOR EVERY AMERICAN. I'VE BALANCED BUDGETS. I DID CUT TAXES, NOT A LOT BECAUSE I WANTED TO SAVE THE MONEY AND MAKE SURE WE BALANCED THE BUDGET WHEN TIMES WERE BAD. I KNOW HOW TO DO THESE THINGS. THAT'S WHAT I OFFER PEOPLE. Yepsen: HEALTH CARE. WHAT'S DR. DEAN'S PRESCRIPTION? Dean: BASED ON WHAT WE DID IN VERMONT. ONE, IF YOU'RE UNDER 25, YOU GET HEALTH INSURANCE THROUGH A GOVERNMENT PROGRAM IF YOU WANT IT. EVERYBODY CAN GET IT. TWO, IF YOU MAKE LESS THAN $33,000 A YEAR, YOU CAN GET A GOVERNMENT HEALTH CARE PROGRAM IF YOU WANT IT. IF YOU GET INSURANCE THROUGH YOUR EMPLOYER, YOU CAN KEEP IT. THREE, IF YOU'RE OVER 65, WE HAVE A REAL PRESCRIPTION BENEFIT, NOT ONE LIKE THE PRESIDENT'S BENEFIT, WHICH GIVES MOST OF THE MONEY TO THE DRUG COMPANIES AND THE INSURANCE COMPANIES. FOUR, IF YOU'RE SELF-EMPLOYED OR YOU MAKE OVER $33,000 A YEAR AND YOUR COMPANY DOESN'T GIVE BENEFITS, YOU CAN BUY THE SAME PROGRAM -- PRIVATE PROGRAM YOUR CONGRESSMAN HAS FOR 7.5 PERCENT OF YOUR INCOME, WHICH MEANS THAT IF YOU MAKE $40,000 A YEAR AND YOU WORK FOR YOURSELF, IT COSTS YOU $300 A MONTH FOR YOUR HEALTH INSURANCE. A BIG IMPROVEMENT OVER WHAT WE'RE DOING NOW. THAT COVERS EVERYBODY AND IT COSTS $87 BILLION A YEAR, WHICH IS THE SAME AMOUNT THAT DICK GEPHARDT VOTED TO SEND TO IRAQ. Yepsen: THE ENVIRONMENT, WHAT DO YOU DO ABOUT IT? Dean: RENEWABLE ENERGY. FIRST, YOU WOULD REVERSE EVERY ENVIRONMENTAL EXECUTIVE ORDER THE PRESIDENT SIGNED BECAUSE THEY ARE ALL BAD. THEN WE NEED RENEWABLE ENERGY. IOWA EXPORTS $6 BILLION A YEAR TO OTHER STATES AND OTHER COUNTRIES IN ORDER TO BUY ENERGY. FOR EVERY BILLION DOLLARS YOU KEPT IN IOWA USING ETHANOL, SOY DIESEL, OR WIND, YOU WOULD CREATE 15- OR 20,000 NEW JOBS. SO RENEWABLE ENERGY IS A SOURCE OF JOBS. IT IMPROVES GLOBAL WARMING DRAMATICALLY. IT'S ALSO A DEFENSE ISSUE. OUR OIL MONEY GOES TO THE MIDDLE EAST WHERE COUNTRIES USE IT TO FUND TERROR AND TO FUND THE TEACHING OF SMALL CHILDREN TO HATE AMERICANS, CHRISTIANS, JEWS, AND MODERATE MUSLIMS. WE NEED A PRESIDENT WHO UNDERSTANDS THAT RENEWABLE ENERGY IS DIRECTLY CONNECTED TO THE DEFENSE OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA. >> Yepsen: EDUCATION. WHAT'S THE FEDERAL ROLE IN K-12 EDUCATION? Dean: HERE AGAIN, THIS IS WHERE I DISAGREE WITH EVERYBODY ELSE RUNNING. I DON'T THINK NO CHILD LEFT BEHIND WAS A GOOD IDEA. IT'S REALLY HURT IOWA -- IOWA HAS HAD ONE OF THE BEST FIVE SCHOOLS IN AMERICA -- FIVE SCHOOL SYSTEMS IN AMERICA FOR THE LAST FIFTY YEARS. TEXAS HAD AMONG THE FIVE WORST. WHAT THE PRESIDENT DID IS APPLY THE TEXAS MODEL TO IOWA, AND SOMEHOW HE THOUGHT IOWA WAS GOING TO GET BETTER. WE'VE GOT TO GET RID OF NO CHILD LEFT BEHIND EXCEPT FOR TWO PIECES OF IT. ONE, THERE'S A LITTLE MONEY FOR POOR KIDS, WHICH IS GOOD. AND THE OTHER IS THERE'S SOME RULES ABOUT IMPROVING THE SCORES OF EVERYBODY. BUT BASICALLY IT'S AN UNFUNDED MANDATE, SO IT RAISED EVERYBODY'S PROPERTY TAXES. THE EDUCATION DEPARTMENT NOW TELLS IOWA HOW THEY HAVE TO TEST THEIR KIDS, WHICH MAKES NO SENSE AT ALL. EVERY DEMOCRAT RUNNING IN THIS RACE EXCEPT FOR ME SUPPORTED THAT. THAT MAKES NO SENSE. WE'VE JUST GOT TO HAVE DEMOCRATS OUTSIDE THE ESTABLISHMENT WHO ARE WILLING TO LOOK AT THINGS AND SAY, "WAIT A MINUTE, THIS DOESN'T MAKE ANY SENSE." YOU KNOW, I'M VERY BLUNT. OCCASIONALLY IT'S GOTTEN ME IN SOME TROUBLE. BUT WHAT PEOPLE GET WITH ME IS THEY KNOW WHERE I STAND. ALL THESE OTHER GUYS ARE FINE PEOPLE, BUT IT'S ALL ABOUT FOCUS GROUPS AND POLLS AND HERE'S HOW YOU GET THEM AND CAN YOU LOOK SINCERE ON THE CAMERA AND ALL THAT OTHER STUFF. WHY DON'T WE JUST GOVERN ACCORDING TO COMMON SENSE? THAT'S THE WAY WE DO IT OUTSIDE WASHINGTON. Yepsen: THE PATRIOT ACT. Dean: THE PATRIOT ACT HAS GOT THREE BIG PROBLEMS. ONE, YOU CANNOT LOCK UP AN AMERICAN CITIZEN WITHOUT TELLING HIM OR HER WHAT SHE'S CHARGED WITH OR LET THEM SEE A LAWYER. TWO, YOU CAN'T RUMMAGE THROUGH THE FILES OF THE VIDEO STORE TO FIND OUT WHO BORROWED WHAT WITHOUT A SEARCH WARRANT. AND THREE, I DON'T THINK IT'S CONSTITUTIONAL TO RUMMAGE THROUGH THE LIBRARY WITHOUT A SEARCH WARRANT AND PROBABLE CAUSE TO SEE WHO BORROWED WHAT LAST WEEK. BUT THE REAL PROBLEM WITH THE PATRIOT ACT IS NOT THOSE KINDS OF THINGS. THE REAL PROBLEM WITH THE PATRIOT ACT IS THE PRESIDENT CONTINUES TO APPOINT MEMBERS OF THE FAR RIGHT FEDERALIST SOCIETY WHO ARE WAY OUTSIDE THE MAINSTREAM WITH MOST AMERICAN LAWYERS AND MOST AMERICANS AND HAVE VERY DIFFERENT IDEAS OF WHAT THE CONSTITUTION IS, SO THE JUDICIARY IS NOT NECESSARILY THERE TO DEFEND US WHEN THE CONGRESS AND THE PRESIDENT OVERREACH INTO OUR PRIVATE LIVES. Yepsen: RACE... WHAT DO YOU DO TO HEAL THE NATION'S RACIAL DIVIDES? Dean: YOU TALK OPENLY ABOUT IT IN WAYS THAT HAVEN'T BEEN TALKED ABOUT BEFORE. ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I'VE DONE IS TALK A LOT ABOUT AFFIRMATIVE ACTION, AND I GET PEOPLE TO LAUGH ABOUT IT. I TELL THE STORY ABOUT MY CHIEF OF STAFF HIRING WOMEN SO MY OFFICE IS A MATRIARCHY AND THEN ASKING HER IF SHE COULD FIND A MAN, AND SHE SAYS, WELL, IT'S SO HARD TO FIND A QUALIFIED MAN. NOW, THE REASON I TELL THAT STORY IS, WE'VE BEEN AT THIS FOR FORTY YEARS IN THIS COUNTRY. AND IT USED TO BE EVERYBODY WAS MEANT TO FEEL GUILTY ABOUT RACISM. THE STORY THAT I WANT TO TALK TO WHITE PEOPLE ABOUT -- BECAUSE BLACK FOLKS -- BROWN FOLKS DON'T NEED LECTURES ABOUT RACISM. THE STORY I WANT TO TALK ABOUT IS OUR UNCONSCIOUS BIASES IN HIRING. THE WALL STREET JOURNAL DID A STORY THAT SHOWED THAT IF YOU'RE WHITE WITH A DRUG CONVICTION, YOU'RE MORE LIKELY TO BE CALLED BACK FOR A JOB INTERVIEW THAN IF YOU'RE AFRICAN-AMERICAN OR LATINO WITH A CLEAN RECORD. THAT'S JUST A FACT. SO WHAT I TALK ABOUT IS OUR UNCONSCIOUS HIRING BIASES AND HOW WE HAVE TO OVERCOME THEM, WHICH IS WHY WE NEED THINGS LIKE AFFIRMATIVE ACTION. THAT'S IMPORTANT. IT'S IMPORTANT TO EXPLAIN TO WHITE AUDIENCES WHY DIVERSITY IS A GOOD THING, WHY IT MAKES SENSE FOR THEM TO BE INVESTED IN DIVERSITY, NOT JUST AFRICAN-AMERICANS AND LATINOS OR MINORITY GROUPS. Yepsen: WE'RE IN RURAL AMERICA HERE IN IOWA. WHY WOULD YOU BE THE BEST PRESIDENT FOR RURAL AMERICA? Dean: BECAUSE I COME FROM A RURAL STATE; BECAUSE THE BIGGEST EXPORT OF IOWA IS THE SAME AS THE BIGGEST EXPORT OF VERMONT, IT'S OUR CHILDREN. I'VE BEEN THROUGH 99 COUNTIES IN IOWA, AND I'VE BEEN TO A LOT OF BEAUTIFUL SMALL TOWNS. AND FOLKS THERE AREN'T VERY YOUNG, AND THE REASON IS THAT -- LIKE MY DAUGHTER, SHE WENT TO COLLEGE. I HOPE SHE GETS MARRIED SOMEDAY AND SHE'LL COME BACK WITH HER KIDS, BUT SHE CAN'T DO IT IF THERE'S NO JOBS. PEOPLE WOULD LOVE TO LIVE IN SMALL-TOWN IOWA BECAUSE THE SCHOOLS ARE GREAT, THEY'RE SAFE, EVERYBODY KNOWS EACH OTHER, IT'S A COMMUNITY, THEY TAKE CARE OF EACH OTHER. BUT THEY DON'T HAVE ANY JOBS. Yepsen: IS THERE SOMETHING SPECIAL YOU HAVE IN MIND TO HELP RURAL AMERICA? Dean: SURE IS. I WANT TO CHANGE OUR AGRICULTURAL POLICY SO CORPORATIONS DON'T OWN ALL THE FARMS. I WANT TO PUT MONEY INTO THINGS LIKE ETHANOL AND WIND SO LOTS OF STATES CAN HELP CREATE ENERGY AND GET MONEY COMING IN. I WANT TO HELP SMALL BUSINESSES. YOU KNOW, THE PRESIDENT GIVES CORPORATIONS THE BIG TAX BREAKS, SO THEY MOVE THEIR HEADQUARTERS TO BERMUDA AND THEIR JOBS TO CHINA. THAT'S NOT GOOD FOR IOWA -- FOR SMALL-TOWN IOWA. WHAT WE REALLY OUGHT TO BE DOING IS HELPING SMALL BUSINESSES WITH THEIR HEALTH INSURANCE COSTS, WITH CAPITAL COSTS, WITH PAPERWORK, SO THEY CAN PROSPER AND GROW. THEY KEEP THEIR JOBS IN THOSE SMALL TOWNS, AND THAT'S THE LIFEBLOOD OF RURAL AMERICA. Yepsen: GOVERNOR, WE'VE GOT JUST OVER A MINUTE LEFT, AND I'LL GIVE IT TO YOU. WHAT ARE THE MOST IMPORTANT THINGS YOU WANT CAUCUS GOERS TO REMEMBER ABOUT YOU AS THEY HEAD OUT ON MONDAY NIGHT? Dean: I WANT THEM TO KNOW THEY HAVE A CHOICE. THIS IS AN ELECTION WHERE THEY CAN REALLY MAKE A DIFFERENCE. YOU CAN VOTE FOR A DIFFERENT PRESIDENT OR YOU CAN VOTE FOR A REAL CHANGE IN AMERICA. YOU'RE NOT GOING TO GET A DIFFERENT PRESIDENT IF YOU ELECT ONE OF THE WASHINGTON INSIDERS AND NOMINATE HIM AS PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES BECAUSE THEY'RE NOT GOING TO WIN, BECAUSE IF YOU RUN A REPUBLICAN AGAINST A REPUBLICAN, THE REPUBLICAN ALWAYS WINS. NOW, I'M NOT SAYING DICK GEPHARDT AND JOHN KERRY AND ALL THOSE GUYS ARE REPUBLICANS, BUT THEY'RE WASHINGTON INSIDERS. WHAT I HAVE DONE IN THIS ELECTION IS STAND UP FOR WHAT I BELIEVE IN. THIS IS TIME FOR A REAL CHANGE IN THIS COUNTRY. THINGS HAVE GONE -- SLID TOO FAR. AND WE HAVEN'T STOOD UP TO THE PRESIDENT. WE NEED TO STAND UP TO THE PRESIDENT. WE NEED NEW LEADERSHIP IN THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY. WE NEED NEW LEADERSHIP IN WASHINGTON, AND I'LL SUPPLY IT. Yepsen: ELECTABILITY... WHY ARE YOU THE MOST ELECTABLE? Dean: BECAUSE WE'RE THE ONLY PERSON -- WE'RE THE ONLY CAMPAIGN THAT CAN BRING NEW PEOPLE IN, AND WE'RE NOT GOING TO BEAT GEORGE BUSH WITH THE ELECTORATE WE HAD IN 2000. YOU'VE GOT TO BRING NEW PEOPLE WHO BELIEVE AND WANT TO BELIEVE IN AMERICA AGAIN INTO THIS RACE, AND NOBODY ELSE CAN DO THAT. Yepsen: GOVERNOR, WE'RE OUT OF TIME. Dean: THANKS, DAVE. Yepsen: THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR BEING WITH US TONIGHT. Dean: THANK YOU. Yepsen: NOW, TOMORROW EVENING WE WRAP UP OUR TEN-PART PRECAUCUS SERIES, AND WE DISCUSS THE CAMPAIGN OF 2004 WITH JAMES HOFFA, PRESIDENT OF THE TEAMSTERS UNION. MR. HOFFA WILL FOCUS ON THE TEAMSTERS' SUPPORT OF DICK GEPHARDT AND ON THE CONCERNS OF AMERICA'S WORKERS. THAT'S TOMORROW EVENING AT 6:30 P.M. AND I HOPE YOU'LL BE JOINING US AT THAT TIME. I'M DAVID YEPSEN OF "THE DES MOINES REGISTER." THANKS FOR BEING WITH US HERE ON STATEWIDE IOWA PUBLIC TELEVISION. CAPTIONS BY: MIDWEST CAPTIONING DES MOINES, IOWA. FUNDING FOR THIS PROGRAM WAS PROVIDED BY "FRIENDS," THE IOWA PUBLIC TELEVISION FOUNDATION... GENERATIONS OF FAMILIES AND FRIENDS WHO FEEL PASSIONATE ABOUT THE PROGRAMS THEY WATCH ON IOWA PUBLIC TELEVISION.
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