Iowa Public Television

Yepsen: THIS PAST TUESDAY'S PRIMARY ELECTION ANOINTED EACH POLITICAL PARTY'S CANDIDATES FOR THIS FALL'S GENERAL ELECTION. REPUBLICANS SELECTED DES MOINES ATTORNEY DOUG GROSS TO CHALLENGE DEMOCRATIC GOVERNOR TOM VILSACK. WE'LL DISCUSS CAMPAIGN POLITICS AND STRATEGY WITH REPUBLICAN GUBERNATORIAL CANDIDATE DOUG GROSS ON THIS EDITION OF "IOWA PRESS."

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ON STATEWIDE IOWA PUBLIC TELEVISION, THIS IS THE FRIDAY, JUNE 7 EDITION OF "IOWA PRESS." HERE IS DEAN BORG.

Borg: WITH THE STATEWIDE PRIMARY ELECTIONS BEHIND US AND WITH POLITICAL PARTY CONVENTIONS JUST AHEAD, THE SUMMER CAMPAIGN SEASON IS OFFICIALLY UNDERWAY. LESS THAN FIVE MONTHS NOW UNTIL NOVEMBER 5'S GENERAL ELECTION. BETWEEN NOW AND THEN, IOWA VOTERS WILL BE HEARING A LOT FROM CANDIDATES FOR THE IOWA LEGISLATURE, AS WELL AS CANDIDATES FOR THE U.S. CONGRESS. IN THE RACE FOR GOVERNOR, INCUMBENT TOM VILSACK NOW KNOWS FOR CERTAIN IT WILL BE THE NAME OF DOUG GROSS ON THE BALLOT WITH HIS OWN. MR. GROSS, CONGRATULATIONS ON YOUR WIN.

Gross: THANKS, DEAN. GREAT TO BE HERE.

Borg: WELCOME BACK TO "IOWA PRESS."

Gross: YOU BET.

Borg: AND ACROSS THE TABLE, TWO MEN YOU KNOW WELL AND WILL GET TO KNOW BETTER ON THE CAMPAIGN TRAIL: "DES MOINES REGISTER" POLITICAL COLUMNIST DAVID YEPSEN AND "ASSOCIATED PRESS" POLITICAL WRITER MIKE GLOVER.

Glover: MR. GROSS, THERE ARE QUESTIONS THAT ARE BEING RAISED ABOUT UNITY IN THE WAKE OF YOUR ELECTION. ROUGHLY TWO-THIRDS OF THE REPUBLICANS WHO WENT TO THE POLLS ON TUESDAY NIGHT VOTED FOR SOMEBODY ELSE. HOW DO YOU BRING THE PARTY TOGETHER?

Gross: WELL, A HUNDRED PERCENT OF ALL THOSE VOTERS, MIKE, VOTED AGAINST TOM VILSACK. AND THE REPUBLICAN PARTY IS UNITED LIKE NEVER BEFORE TO MAKE CERTAIN WE HAVE A NEW GOVERNOR IN THE FALL, SO I'M VERY CONFIDENT. THE GREAT THING WAS THE NIGHT OF THE ELECTION, EVEN THOUGH IT WAS A VERY CLOSE ELECTION AND WE HAD A VERY HIGH TURNOUT, ALMOST 200,000 REPUBLICANS, WHICH SHOWS THAT OUR BASE IS ENERGIZED. I TALKED WITH BOTH BOB VANDER PLAATS AND STEVE SUKUP, BOTH WHO RAN AGGRESSIVE CAMPAIGNS. BOTH INDICATED TO ME THEY CONCEDED THE ELECTION. THEY INDICATED TO ME THAT I HAD THEIR UNQUALIFIED SUPPORT, AND THEY HAVE OFFERED TO HELP ME WITH THEIR ORGANIZATIONAL PEOPLE AND OTHERWISE DURING THE COURSE OF THE CAMPAIGN. AFTER THAT, THE NEXT DAY I TRAVELED AROUND THE STATE OF IOWA, INCLUDING TO THE AREAS WHERE THEY DID PARTICULARLY WELL, AND I GOT A LOT OF SUPPORT. SO I'M VERY, VERY CONFIDENT, MIKE, THAT WE'VE GOT A UNITED REPUBLICAN PARTY.

Glover: WHAT CONCRETE STEPS CAN YOU TAKE TO BRING THAT -- THOSE WINGS TOGETHER? CAMPAIGN WITH THEM? DO A UNITY TOUR WITH THEM? WHAT CONCRETE STEPS?

Gross: MIKE, WHAT WE'RE GOING TO DO IS, FIRST OF ALL, WE'VE ALREADY REACHED OUT TO THEM INDIVIDUALLY. IN ADDITION TO THAT, WE'RE REACHING OUT TO THEIR SUPPORTERS, WHICH IS VERY IMPORTANT, I THINK, AND GETTING THEIR ORGANIZATIONAL PEOPLE INVOLVED IN OUR CAMPAIGN. WE DIDN'T HAVE IDEOLOGICAL DIFFERENCES IN THIS CAMPAIGN. IF YOU LOOK AT THE ELECTION RESULTS, A LOT OF IT WAS SIMPLY REGIONAL: WHERE WE CAME FROM; WHERE WE GREW UP. THAT'S WHERE A LOT OF THE BASIS SUPPORT FOR EACH OF US WAS. WE'RE ALL UNITED ABOUT BEATING TOM VILSACK IN THE FALL. WE'RE TAKING THOSE STEPS TO REACH OUT TO THOSE INDIVIDUALS AND THEIR SUPPORTERS NOW. AND I'M VERY, VERY CONFIDENT WE'RE ALL GOING TO BE UNITED IN THE FALL.

Yepsen: ONE OF THE FIRST DECISIONS YOU HAVE TO MAKE IS TO PICK A RUNNING MATE. WHO IS YOUR RUNNING MATE GOING TO BE?

Gross: WELL, DAVE, IT'S TOO EARLY TO SAY, BUT THANKS FOR ASKING. I'VE SET UP A PROCESS THAT -- POTENTIAL CANDIDATES, THOSE WHO ARE INTERESTED AND THOSE WE WANT TO REACH OUT TO. AND IT'S REALLY TOO EARLY TO NAME NAMES AT THIS POINT, BUT THE PROCESS IS UNDERWAY.

Yepsen: WELL, WHAT ARE YOU LOOKING FOR?

Gross: THE KIND OF CHARACTERISTICS, DAVID, I'M LOOKING FOR -- ONE IS I WANT SOMEONE WHO CAN BE GOVERNOR, WHO'S CAPABLE OF BEING GOVERNOR. THAT'S FIRST AND FOREMOST. SECONDLY, I WANT TO HAVE SOMEONE WHO CAN HAVE THE ABILITY TO ACTUALLY RUN AN AGENCY OR A DEPARTMENT. NOW, THAT'S FAIRLY NEW. WE'VE NEVER DONE THAT IN IOWA BEFORE, BUT I DON'T THINK WE HAVE ENOUGH RESOURCES TO HAVE A LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR WHO SORT OF ACTS AS CO-GOVERNOR AND APPEARS AT EVENTS. WE NEED TO HAVE A LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR WHO CAN ACTUALLY PERFORM AN EFFECTIVE FUNCTION OF MANAGEMENT IN STATE GOVERNMENT, SO I'M LOOKING FOR SOMEONE WHO BOTH CAN BE AN EFFECTIVE GOVERNOR BUT WHO ALSO CAN OPERATE OR RUN EITHER A STATE AGENCY OR A SIGNIFICANT STATE PROGRAM.

Yepsen: GO BACK TO MIKE'S UNITY QUESTION. IS IT POSSIBLE THAT STEVE SUKUP OR BOB VANDER PLAATS WOULD BE ON YOUR LIST?

Gross: DAVID, I'M NOT RULING ANYONE OUT AT THIS POINT BECAUSE WE'RE JUST GOING THROUGH THE PROCESS OF REVIEWING THAT. I'VE NOT DISCUSSED THAT WITH THEM, AND WE HAD OUR CONVERSATION TUESDAY NIGHT -- I GUESS IT WAS WEDNESDAY MORNING. I'VE NOT DISCUSSED THAT WITH THEM, BUT I'M CERTAINLY NOT RULING ANYTHING OUT AT THIS POINT.

Yepsen: THERE'S SOME TALK THAT YOU'VE GOT TO PICK AN EASTERN IOWA, PRO-LIFE WOMAN BECAUSE YOU'RE FROM DES MOINES, BORN IN DEFIANCE, A MODERATE. DOES THAT MAKE ANY SENSE TO YOU?

Gross: DAVID, I THINK WHAT YOU NEED IS SOMEONE WHO IS CAPABLE OF BEING GOVERNOR, WHO IS CAPABLE OF OPERATING A PROGRAM OR AN AGENCY OF STATE GOVERNMENT. AND FRANKLY, THE THIRD POINT, DAVID, I NEED TO BE ABLE TO GET ALONG WITH THEM. THAT'S IMPORTANT BECAUSE WE NEED TO BE A TEAM. SO WE'LL LOOK AT THOSE FACTORS AND, FRANKLY, WE'LL LOOK AT PEOPLE ALL OVER THE STATE OF IOWA OF ANY PERSUASION, AND WE'LL MAKE CERTAIN THAT WE GET SOMEONE WHO MEETS THOSE CRITERIA. DAVID, ARE YOU INTERESTED? [ LAUGHTER ]

Yepsen: I HAVE A JOB. [ LAUGHTER ]

Yepsen: I HAVE A GOOD JOB.

Gross: OKAY.

Borg: WHAT DO YOU DISCERN AS THE MOOD OF THE ELECTORATE? WHAT'S GOING TO DRIVE THAT ELECTION?

Gross: YOU KNOW, AS I GO AROUND THE STATE -- AND IT'S INTERESTING WHEN I VISIT WITH PEOPLE, THEY INDICATE -- SOME PEOPLE COME UP TO ME AND SAY, "YOU KNOW, WE VOTED FOR TOM VILSACK LAST ELECTION BUT, BY GOSH, WE'RE NOT GOING TO MAKE THAT MISTAKE THIS TIME. WE'RE WITH YOU THIS TIME." AND I THINK WHAT'S HAPPENED IS PEOPLE UNDERSTOOD THAT WE HAD THIRTY YEARS OF REPUBLICAN LEADERSHIP IN IOWA, AND WE EXPERIMENTED WITH A DEMOCRATIC GOVERNOR FOR THE LAST THREE AND A HALF YEARS, AND IT DIDN'T WORK. IT DIDN'T WORK BECAUSE PEOPLE WERE VERY CONCERNED ABOUT THE FACT THAT WE'VE GOT CLOSE TO A BILLION-DOLLAR BUDGET DEFICIT STARING US IN THE FACE WHEN WE START THE NEXT FISCAL YEAR. WE'VE GOT A SITUATION WHERE EDUCATION -- PUBLIC EDUCATION, PARTICULARLY IN IOWA, ALL THE WAY FROM K-16, IS STRESSED LIKE NEVER BEFORE, AND WE'VE GOT AN ECONOMY THAT'S NOT GROWING AND, IN FACT, DECLINING IN IOWA. AND THEY'RE VERY, VERY CONCERNED ABOUT THAT. AND I WAS INTERESTED -- I WAS ON JAN MICHAELSON THE OTHER DAY, AND SOMEBODY CALLED UP AND SAID, "DOUG, WHEN YOU SAY WE NEED A NEW LEADER, YOU'RE NOT CORRECT. THE POINT IS WE NEED A LEADER." AND THAT'S REALLY WHY I'M RUNNING FOR GOVERNOR; WE NEED A LEADER IN IOWA AGAIN.

Borg: ARE IOWANS DISCOURAGED?

Gross: DISCOURAGED?

Borg: YES.

Gross: I THINK PARTICULARLY IN RURAL AREAS, DEAN, I WORRY ABOUT THE EXTENT TO WHICH PEOPLE ARE CLOSE TO GIVING UP ON THEIR ABILITY TO GROW THEIR COMMUNITIES AGAIN AND HAVE EFFECTIVE AND QUALITY COMMUNITIES. IN MANY PLACES, IN SOME COUNTY SEAT TOWNS WHEN THEY'RE FAR AWAY FROM AN URBAN AREA, THEY'VE LOST A LOT OF THEIR MIDDLE CLASS, BECAUSE WE DON'T HAVE THE QUALITY OF JOBS IN A LOT OF THESE LOCATIONS WHERE THEY CAN MAINTAIN A MIDDLE CLASS. WHEN YOU LOSE A MIDDLE CLASS, YOU LOSE YOUR ABILITY TO REALLY FUNCTION EFFECTIVELY AS A COMMUNITY. I THINK WE'RE CLOSE. I THINK IOWA IS AT A CROSSROADS RIGHT NOW, DEAN. I MEAN, THAT'S REALLY WHY I'M RUNNING RIGHT NOW. I'VE STILL GOT THREE KIDS AT HOME. IT WOULD BE A LOT EASIER FOR ME TO STAY HOME AND TAKE CARE OF THEM. I'M RUNNING RIGHT NOW BECAUSE I THINK IOWA IS AT A CRITICAL CROSSROADS AND WE NEED TO DETERMINE WHETHER OR NOT WE'RE GOING TO GROW THIS STATE AGAIN.

Glover: LET'S TAKE -- THERE ARE A NUMBER OF NEGATIVES THAT HAVE BEEN RAISED ABOUT YOU IN THE COURSE OF THIS CAMPAIGN AND WILL BE RAISED THROUGHOUT THE SUMMER AND FALL, SO LET'S GO THROUGH A COUPLE OF THOSE. ONE OF THE NEGATIVES THAT THE GOVERNOR IS ALREADY RAISING AND WILL BE RAISING AGAIN IS THAT YOU'RE A LOBBYIST WHO'S REPRESENTED CLIENTS THAT A LOT OF PEOPLE CONSIDER UNSAVORY, IN PARTICULAR, BIG HOG PRODUCERS THAT HAVE ENVIRONMENTAL PROBLEMS AND GAMBLING INTERESTS. HOW DO YOU RESPOND TO THAT?

Gross: SURE, MIKE. I'M A LAWYER AND I MANAGE THE THIRD LARGEST LAW FIRM IN IOWA, AND AND I'M PROUD OF THAT. WE'VE DOUBLED IN SIZE IN THE LAST FIVE YEARS SINCE I'VE BEEN MANAGING PARTNER, SO I THINK I'VE GOT A RECORD IN THE PRIVATE SECTOR THAT'S VERY, VERY EXEMPLARY. GOVERNOR VILSACK WAS A LAWYER. HE REPRESENTED CLIENTS, SOME SAVERY, SOME UNSAVORY. IF WE WANT TO GO BACK AND MAKE A CASE THAT A LAWYER IS HIS CLIENT, THEN HE HAS THE SAME DIFFICULTIES THAT MAYBE SOME PEOPLE WOULD SAY I HAVE. SO I DON'T THINK THAT ISSUE IS EVEN RELEVANT, FRANKLY. BUT REGARDLESS OF THAT, THE PEOPLE I'VE WORKED WITH AND THE COMPANIES THAT I'VE WORKED WITH AROUND THE STATE, I'VE WORKED HARD WITH THEM TO TRY TO HELP THEM REALIZE THEIR GOALS, TO GROW THEIR BUSINESSES. I ALSO UNDERSTAND HOW BUSINESS WORKS AND WHAT YOU NEED TO HAVE IN ORDER TO CREATE GOOD QUALITY JOBS IN IOWA. I'VE HAD THAT OPPORTUNITY. I THINK THAT'S A PLUS. IN TERMS OF HOGS, SPECIFICALLY, MIKE, I WORK WITH SMALL PRODUCERS AS WELL AS LARGE. AND A LOT OF SMALL PRODUCERS TODAY ARE STRESSED LIKE NEVER BEFORE. WE'VE GOT A DECLINING MARKET. THEY'RE HAVING DIFFICULTY ACCESSING MARKET. FRANKLY, WHEN WE VISIT WITH PRESIDENT BUSH LATER, I'M GOING TO BE VISITING WITH HIM ABOUT WAYS IN WHICH WE CAN TRY TO DO SOME THINGS TO IMPROVE THE MARKET DEMAND FOR PORK RIGHT NOW, BECAUSE I UNDERSTAND THAT INDUSTRY. IN TERMS OF GAMING, WE'VE TALKED ABOUT THAT BEFORE ON THIS SHOW. I DID HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO WORK WITH SOME PEOPLE UP IN DUBUQUE AND TRY TO HELP THEM SAVE OVER 600 JOBS UP THERE THAT WERE TIED TO THAT, AND I'M PROUD OF THAT. I DON'T APOLOGIZE FOR THAT.

Glover: ARE YOU GOING TO MAKE AN ISSUE OF HIS CLIENT LIST?

Gross: MIKE, BOTTOM LINE IS, IF HE WANTS TO MAKE AN ISSUE OF MY CLIENT LIST, I GUESS I HAVE TO MAKE AN ISSUE OF HIS CLIENT LIST. BUT I DON'T THINK THAT SERVES ANY PURPOSE. I THINK THE ISSUE IN THIS CAMPAIGN IS HIS RECORD AS GOVERNOR -- HE'S BEEN GOVERNOR FOR THE LAST THREE AND A HALF YEARS -- HIS RECORD HAS GOVERNOR, AND WHAT WE BOTH PLAN TO DO FOR THE FUTURE OF THE STATE. THAT'S WHY I'VE SUGGESTED THAT WE HAVE FIVE DEBATES ALL ACROSS THE STATE OF IOWA, HAVE EACH OF THOSE DEBATES FOCUS ON ONE INDIVIDUAL ISSUE SO WE CAN REALLY GET INTO IT SO DAVID CAN BE HAPPY THAT WE'RE BEING POLICY WONKISH ABOUT IT, AND REALLY FOCUS ON THE ISSUE AND TALK ABOUT IT IN DEPTH AND SEE WHAT OUR PLANS ARE WITH REGARD TO IT FOR THE FUTURE OF THE STATE OF IOWA. INSTEAD OF JUST A CAMPAIGN OF SOUND BITES, LET'S HAVE A CAMPAIGN DISCUSSING THE ISSUES. I THINK THAT WOULD BE GOOD.

Yepsen: ANOTHER NEGATIVE THAT GETS THROWN AT YOU IS THAT YOU'RE A BIG CITY DES MOINES LAWYER, THAT YOU CANNOT RELATE TO PEOPLE IN SMALL TOWNS AS A RESULT OF THAT, THAT YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND THEIR PROBLEMS. WE HEARD THAT DURING THE PRIMARY. I HEARD GOVERNOR VILSACK MENTION THE SAME THING RIGHT OUT OF THE BOX. HOW DO YOU RESPOND?

Gross: YOU KNOW, IT'S INTERESTING. GOVERNOR VILSACK WOULD SAY I'M NOT A MAN FROM DEFIANCE. I MEAN, I'M EVERY BIT A MAN FROM DEFIANCE AS HE IS A MAN FROM PITTSBURGH. WE'RE ALL A PRODUCT OF OUR EXPERIENCES. AND HE SHOULD HAVE BEEN WITH ME THE NIGHT BEFORE THE ELECTION ON MAIN STREET DEFIANCE. GOSH, WE PROBABLY HAD -- EXCUSE ME. WE PROBABLY HAD 300 PEOPLE THERE. THERE'S 345 PEOPLE IN TOWN, AND THOSE PEOPLE WERE THERE BECAUSE THEY'RE PROUD OF DEFIANCE. YOU KNOW, I'M PROUD TO BE FROM THERE. AND FOR PEOPLE TO SAY THAT I'M NOT WHO I AM, THAT I'M NOT AN IOWAN, ALL THEY'RE TRYING TO DO IS DIVIDE US. WE DON'T NEED TO BE DIVIDED TODAY. IOWA NEEDS TO BE UNITED LIKE NEVER BEFORE BECAUSE WE NEED TO BRING GROWTH BACK TO TOWNS LIKE DEFIANCE AGAIN. INTERESTING THING, THE MAYOR OF DEFIANCE, JOHNNY WELLS, WAS JOKING AROUND AND HE WAS SAYING THAT HE WAS GOING TO ISSUE A PROCLAMATION: ANYBODY WHO DIDN'T VOTE FOR DOUG GROSS THE NEXT DAY COULD LEAVE TOWN. THAT SHOWS THE PEOPLE OF DEFIANCE KNOW WHERE I CAME FROM.

Yepsen: THIS SEEMS TO BE KIND OF AN EMOTIONAL POINT WITH YOU.

Gross: IT IS BECAUSE, GOSH, YOU KNOW, I GO AROUND THE STATE OF IOWA AND VISIT A LOT OF THESE SMALL TOWNS AND VISIT COMMUNITIES THAT I REMEMBER GROWING UP -- AND ALSO WORKING WITH GOVERNOR BRANSTAD AND GOVERNOR RAY -- AND THEY'RE JUST A SHADOW OF WHAT THEY USED TO BE, DAVID. AND OUR STATE IS, IN MANY OF THESE RURAL LOCATIONS, IS A SHADOW OF WHAT IT USED TO BE. I AM PASSIONATE ABOUT IT, DAVID, BECAUSE I FEEL IN MY HEART --

Yepsen: EXCUSE ME.

Gross: I'M SORRY, DAVID.

Yepsen: SO IF HE'S GOING TO TALK ABOUT YOU BEING FROM DES MOINES, YOU'RE GOING TO TALK ABOUT HIM BEING FROM PENNSYLVANIA.

Gross: I JUST THINK THAT WHAT HE'S DOING WITH THAT IS SO DIVISIVE, SO WRONG ABOUT WHAT IOWA NEEDS TODAY THAT HE SHOULDN'T EVEN BRING IT UP. I MEAN, HE DIDN'T GROW UP IN IOWA. I DID. BUT DESPITE THAT, WE'RE ALL IOWANS. WE HAVE PEOPLE HERE WHO HAVE MOVED HERE FROM ALL PARTS OF THE COUNTRY. WE DON'T NEED TO TALK ABOUT WHERE WE CAME FROM. WE NEED TO TALK ABOUT WHAT WE WANT TO DO. FOR HIM TO RAISE THOSE KINDS OF ISSUES I THINK IS JUST SILLY AND COUNTERPRODUCTIVE.

Glover: ONE OTHER NEGATIVE THAT WILL BE RAISED ABOUT YOU IS YOU'RE RUNNING FOR GOVERNOR, THE STATE'S TOP POLITICAL OFFICE, AND YOU'VE NEVER RUN FOR PUBLIC OFFICE BEFORE. THAT'S ALMOST UNPRECEDENTED. HOW DO YOU ANSWER THE QUESTION THAT "I'M RUNNING FOR THE STATE'S FIRST, HIGHEST POLITICAL OFFICE AS MY FIRST TIME OUT."

Gross: YEAH. WELL, PEOPLE WERE RAISING THAT WHEN I RAN IN THE PRIMARY TOO. AND I ANNOUNCED SO LATE. I ANNOUNCED MARCH 4, SO WE HAD TO RUN AN EXTRAORDINARY CAMPAIGN, BASICALLY A THREE-MONTH CAMPAIGN, BUT WE WERE SUCCESSFUL. WE WERE SUCCESSFUL BECAUSE I'VE HAD EXPERIENCE WORKING WITH BOTH GOVERNOR RAY AND GOVERNOR BRANSTAD IN THE GOVERNOR'S OFFICE. I'VE GOT EXECUTIVE EXPERIENCE IN STATE GOVERNMENT, PROBABLY LIKE NOBODY ELSE HAS EVER RUN FOR THE OFFICE BEFORE. I'VE ALSO MANAGED PROGRAMS AND DIVISIONS WITHIN STATE GOVERNMENT. I RAN THE REGENTS BUDGET FOR TWO YEARS. I UNDERSTAND GOVERNMENT PROBABLY AS WELL AS ANYBODY WHO'S EVER RUN FOR THE OFFICE.

Glover: AND IN HIS ANNOUNCEMENT GOVERNOR VILSACK SOUGHT TO HOLD YOU ACCOUNTABLE FOR SOME THINGS THAT HAPPENED DURING YOUR TENURE IN STATE GOVERNMENT. HE SAYS THAT DURING YOUR TENURE IN STATE GOVERNMENT: (A) YOU RAISED THE SALES TAX; (B) YOU HID A $400-MILLION DEFICIT FROM THE VOTERS; AND (C) BUNGLED THE BUDGET. HOW DO YOU RESPOND TO THOSE CHARGES?

Gross: WELL, FIRST OF ALL, IT'S INTERESTING THAT GOVERNOR VILSACK WOULD ATTEMPT TO GO BACK TO THE 1980S DURING --

Glover: WELL, YOU CLAIM EXPERIENCE DURING 1980 AS A REASON FOR GETTING ELECTED.

Gross: IT'S INTERESTING, THOUGH, MIKE, THAT HE WOULD GO BACK TO THE 1980S -- LISTEN TO ME -- GO BACK TO THE 1980S AND TRY TO HOLD ME ACCOUNTABLE FOR THINGS THAT -- WHILE GOVERNOR BRANSTAD WAS IN OFFICE AND WAS GOVERNOR OF THE STATE. I SUSPECT WHAT THAT MEANS, THEN, IS THAT HE HOLDS JOHN NORRIS AND JOHN CACCIATORE RESPONSIBLE FOR THINGS THAT OCCURRED DURING HIS TENURE. I MEAN, THE BOTTOM LINE HERE IS THE GOVERNOR MAKES THE DECISIONS WHEN THE GOVERNOR IS IN OFFICE. HE OUGHT TO TAKE RESPONSIBILITY JUST LIKE GOVERNOR BRANSTAD HAS. THE OTHER THING IS HE OUGHT TO LOOK TO SEE WHEN I WAS IN THE GOVERNOR'S OFFICE. I WAS CHIEF OF STAFF FROM 1984 TO 1989, DURING THE MIDDLE OF THE FARM CRISIS. BETWEEN 1984 AND 1989 WE DID NOT RAISE THE SALES TAX. WE AGREED TO REORGANIZE AND DOWNSIZE STATE GOVERNMENT IN 1986. THAT'S THE EFFORT THAT I WORKED WITH GOVERNOR BRANSTAD ON.

Yepsen: MR. GROSS, YOU'RE RIGHT. I DO LIKE TO TALK ABOUT ISSUES --

Gross: I KNOW. I FIGURED YOU WOULD, DAVID.

Yepsen: LET'S GET AT SOME OF THEM. POLLS TELL US THAT THE MOST IMPORTANT ISSUE IOWANS ARE CONCERNED ABOUT ARE THE SCHOOLS. WHAT WOULD GOVERNOR DOUG GROSS DO ABOUT A LOCAL SCHOOLS IN IOWA?

Gross: DAVID, IF YOU TALK TO EDUCATORS -- THAT'S THE FIRST THING THAT I'D DO. I'D GO TO THE SCHOOLS. I'D VISIT -- WELL, WE'VE GOT THREE KIDS IN PUBLIC SCHOOLS RIGHT NOW, SO I CAN TALK TO MY OWN KIDS WHEN THEY COME HOME. WE'VE GOT A LOT OF GOOD FRIENDS THAT ARE TEACHERS, A LOT OF SUPPORTERS THAT ARE TEACHERS, AND I'VE GONE TO CLASSES AND VISITED WITH THEM. WHAT YOU DO WHEN YOU VISIT WITH THEM IS YOU FIND OUT THAT THINGS ARE NOT SO GOOD IN PUBLIC EDUCATION, AND THE ADMINISTRATORS AND THE TEACHERS AND THE STUDENTS AND THE PARENTS TELL YOU THAT. YOU'VE GOT TEACHERS TEACHING WITH CLASS -- WITH TEXTBOOKS THAT IN SOME CASES ARE OLDER THAN THE KIDS, AND THEY'RE DISTRESSED BY THAT BECAUSE THEY CAN'T DO A GOOD JOB WHEN THEY DON'T HAVE THOSE KINDS OF RESOURCES. YOU'VE GOT PARENTS THAT ARE VERY CONCERNED ABOUT IT. WHAT I WOULD DO IS THIS, DAVID, IS, FIRST OF ALL, MAKE EDUCATION TRULY THE TOP PUBLIC PRIORITY IN IOWA IN TERMS OF EXPENDITURE OF FUNDS. WHERE I DIFFER WITH GOVERNOR VILSACK IS THAT OF HIS FIRST BUDGET HE PRESENTED IN JANUARY, $80 MILLION OF THE $90 MILLION OF AVAILABLE RESOURCES WENT TO PAY FOR STATE PUBLIC EMPLOYEE UNION SALARY INCREASES THAT HE NEGOTIATED. THEY'RE ALMOST DOUBLE DIGIT IN SIZE NEXT YEAR. AS A RESULT, EDUCATION IS LEFT TO GET THE SCRAPS, ONE-TIME MONEY. SO AS A RESULT, WE'VE GOT SINGLE MOTHERS WHO TODAY ARE NOT ABLE TO GET A COMMUNITY COLLEGE EDUCATION TO IMPROVE THEIR PROSPECTS IN LIFE BECAUSE OUR TUITIONS ARE 150 PERCENT OF THE NATIONAL AVERAGE. WE'VE GOT TUITIONS AT OUR STATE UNIVERSITIES THAT ARE PROBABLY GOING TO BE CLOSE TO 50-PERCENT INCREASES WHEN THEY GET DONE THIS YEAR IN THE COURSE OF THREE YEARS. WE ARE LIMITING THE PEOPLE'S ABILITY TO GET ACCESS TO PUBLIC EDUCATION SIMPLY BECAUSE WE HAVEN'T MADE FUNDING OF PUBLIC EDUCATION THE NUMBER ONE PRIORITY IN IOWA. IF YOU LOOK AT HIS BUDGET, THAT'S WHAT IT TELLS YOU.

Glover: THERE'S BEEN A LOT OF TALK DURING THE PRIMARY CAMPAIGN, I ASSUME DURING THE GENERAL ELECTION CAMPAIGN AS WELL, ABOUT TAXES. HOW WILL YOU CHANGE IOWA'S TAX STRUCTURE?

Gross: MIKE, OUR TAX STRUCTURE -- THE CONCERN I HAVE ABOUT IT -- PARTICULARLY I LOOK AT THE PROPERTY AND INCOME TAXES. I'M CONCERNED ABOUT -- THE NATURE OF THOSE TWO SYSTEMS WE HAVE IN IOWA IS REALLY KIND OF A GOBBLEDYGOOK OF SYSTEMS THAT OCCURRED OVER THE COURSE OF FIFTY OR SO YEARS. AS A RESULT OF THAT, WE HAVE A SYSTEM THAT DOESN'T PROMOTE GROWTH AND DEVELOPMENT IN IOWA. IT IN FACT PENALIZES SUCCESS. WE HAVE A TOP INCOME TAX RATE OF 8.89. EVEN AFTER FEDERAL DEDUCTABILITY, IT'S STILL 6.5. SOUTH DAKOTA HAS ZERO. ILLINOIS HAS THREE. WE HAVE A PROPERTY TAX SYSTEM WITH COMMERCIAL PROPERTY TAX RATES -- IF YOU BUILD AN APARTMENT BUILDING IN IOWA, YOU PAY PROPERTY TAXES THAT ARE EQUIVALENT WITH IF YOU HAD BUILT THAT BUILDING IN MIDTOWN MANHATTAN. SO WE'VE GOT A SYSTEM THAT PENALIZES THE VERY KINDS OF THINGS, LIKE SUCCESS AND DEVELOPMENT, THAT WE WANT TO PROMOTE. SO WHAT WE'RE GOING TO DO -- AND I'VE TALKED TO A NUMBER OF ORGANIZATIONS WHO HAVE BEEN INTERESTED IN THIS AND HAVE SORT OF REASONS TO PREVENT CHANGE IN THE PAST WITH REGARD TO THESE SYSTEMS, AND I'VE ASKED THEM TO WORK WITH ME AND LET'S GET TO WORK ON DEVELOPING OVERHAULING THAT ENTIRE SYSTEM TOP TO BOTTOM. AND WE'RE WORKING ON IT NOW.

Borg: IN ADDITION TO YOUR PASSION THAT YOU'VE ALREADY STATED ABOUT RURAL IOWA, THERE IS A LOT OF EVIDENCE TO UNDERSCORE THE FACT THAT INFRASTRUCTURE AND ECONOMIC VITALITY IN RURAL IOWA IS SEVERELY ERODING. HOW ARE YOU GOING TO TURN IT AROUND?

Gross: WELL, IT'S INTERESTING, DEAN, I HEAR A LOT OF PEOPLE SAY, PARTICULARLY THOSE WHO LIVE IN DES MOINES, SAY, "HEY, WE OUGHT TO CLOSE DOWN A LOT OF OUR INFRASTRUCTURE IN RURAL IOWA, THAT WE HAVE TOO MUCH OF IT." AND I PREFER TO LOOK AT IT AS AN ASSET RATHER THAN A LIABILITY. A LOT OF PLACES WOULD LOVE TO HAVE THE KIND OF ROAD SYSTEM, THE KIND OF EDUCATION SYSTEM, THE KIND OF COMMUNITY RESOURCES, INSTITUTIONS THAT WE HAVE ALL OVER OUR STATE. THEY'D SEE THOSE AS ASSETS TO GROW RATHER THAN LIABILITIES TO GROW. SO I THINK WHAT WE NEED TO DO IS LOOK AT IT IN A DIFFERENT WAY. I'M CONCERNED THAT IF WE DON'T BRING GROWTH BACK TO MANY OF THESE LOCATIONS, DEAN, WE WILL NOT BE ABLE TO SUPPORT THAT INFRASTRUCTURE AND WE WILL LOSE IT PERMANENTLY AND THEIR CHANCES OF EVER GROWING WILL BE LOST FOREVER. SO WE NEED A VERY AGGRESSIVE EFFORT NOW FOCUSED ON ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT AND GROWTH IN ALL PARTS OF THE STATE. NOW, I'D LOVE TO TALK ABOUT ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT FOR AN HOUR, BECAUSE WE COULD LINE ONE OF YOUR WALLS HERE WITH ALL THE STUDIES THAT HAVE BEEN DONE ON ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT AND HOW YOU MAKE IOWA GROW AGAIN, BUT I DON'T THINK IT'S THAT COMPLICATED.

Borg: WHEN YOU SAID ABOUT INFRASTRUCTURE, THAT SOUNDS LIKE AN ARGUMENT AGAINST CONSOLIDATION.

Gross: WHAT I TALKED ABOUT, DEAN, AND I REALLY STRONGLY BELIEVE THIS BECAUSE I GREW UP IN RURAL IOWA, I'VE GOT FAMILY THERE, I UNDERSTAND IT. IF WE IN STATE GOVERNMENT SAY WE'RE GOING TO CLOSE DOWN YOUR SCHOOL, WE'RE GOING TO CLOSE DOWN YOUR COUNTY, NOT ONLY IS THAT THE WRONG THING TO DO, BUT IT ALSO WILL BE COUNTERPRODUCTIVE, BECAUSE OUR GOAL OUGHT TO BE THIS: OUR GOAL OUGHT TO BE TO REDUCE THE COSTS OF GOVERNMENT AND IMPROVE THE SERVICES. NOW, YOU CAN DO THAT BY HAVING COUNTIES AND SCHOOL DISTRICTS SHARE THINGS JUST AS MUCH AS BY CLOSING THEM DOWN. FOR EXAMPLE, IF SCHOOLS WISH TO BUILD A REGIONAL HIGH SCHOOL IN ORDER TO PROVIDE BETTER COURSE OFFERINGS AND BETTER EDUCATION IN RURAL AREAS FOR THEIR SECONDARY STUDENTS, I THINK THE STATE OUGHT TO COME IN AND HELP THEM DO IT. I THINK WE OUGHT TO HELP THEM DO IT SO WE PROVIDE INCENTIVES FOR SHARING IT RATHER THAN PENALIZE THEM JUST BECAUSE OF WHERE THEY LIVE.

Yepsen: ARE THERE OTHER THINGS LIKE THAT -- SPECIFIC THINGS THAT YOU WANT TO DO DIFFERENTLY? I MEAN, YOU'RE RIGHT, WE'VE HAD LOTS OF STUDIES. EVERYBODY HAS TRIED EVERYTHING. SO THE QUESTION REALLY BECOMES WHAT ARE WE GOING TO DO DIFFERENTLY TO HELP RURAL TOWNS LIKE DEFIANCE OR JEFFERSON, PLACES LIKE THAT.

Gross: AND NOT JUST RURAL EITHER, DAVID, I THINK THE STATE'S ROLE IS NOT TO PICK WINNERS AND LOSERS, THE STATE'S ROLE IS TO CREATE AN ECONOMIC CLIMATE WHERE WE CAN ALL SUCCEED. NOW, HOW DO WE DO THAT? THE STATE -- THE WAY THE STATE IMPACTS GROWTH AND DEVELOPMENT IS IN THREE WAYS. ONE IS WITH THE SOCIAL -- OR THE HUMAN CAPITAL IT PROVIDES, WITH THE PEOPLE IT EDUCATES. AND THAT'S WHERE WE'VE ALWAYS HAD AN ACE IN THE HOLE. OUR WORKERS ARE MORE PRODUCTIVE THAN MOST OTHERS, BUT WE ARE STRESSED, PARTICULARLY COMMUNITY COLLEGES EDUCATING SKILLED WORKERS ARE STRESSED LIKE NEVER BEFORE. 25,000 MORE STUDENTS, THE SAME AMOUNT OF MONEY AS 1998. THE SECOND WAY THE STATE IMPACTS DEVELOPMENT IS WHAT THE PHYSICAL INFRASTRUCTURE PROVIDES: ROADS, BRIDGES, TELECOMMUNICATIONS, BROAD-BAND ACCESS, AND AIR. I THINK WE'VE GOT TO DO SOMETHING ABOUT AIR TRANSPORTATION IN THIS STATE BECAUSE IT'S LIMITING OUR ABILITY TO GROW THE KIND OF QUALITY JOBS WE WANT, SERIOUSLY. AND I WANT THE STATE TO PLAY A ROLE IN THAT. ALSO, DAVID, I THINK WE OUGHT TO MAKE SOME STRATEGIC INVESTMENTS, SUCH AS BUILD A BIOLOGICS FACILITY IN IOWA SO IOWA IS THE CENTER OF THE BIOPHARMACEUTICAL INDUSTRY. WE HAVE TO BUILD THAT SO WE DO THAT. THE LAST IS ITS TAX AND REGULATORY CLIMATE, AND I'VE SUGGESTED WE DOUBLE THE R AND D TAX CREDIT, WE EXTEND THE NET OPERATING LOSSES YOU CAN CARRY FORWARD FOR START-UP BUSINESSES FROM THREE TO FIVE YEARS, YOU CREATE AN INVESTMENT TAX CREDIT FOR MANUFACTURERS IN IOWA BECAUSE WE NEED TO FOCUS ON MANUFACTURING. WHEN YOU BOIL IT ALL DOWN, THE PROBLEM IS THIS: 50 PERCENT OF OUR WORKERS IN IOWA MAKE $11 AN HOUR OR LESS. AND PEOPLE CRY ABOUT THE FACT THAT WE'RE LOSING WORKERS AND WE'RE LOSING POPULATION, WE DON'T HAVE ENOUGH YOUNG PEOPLE. THE REASON IS WE HAVEN'T PROVIDED ENOUGH OPPORTUNITY FOR THEM, AND THE ONLY WAY WE CAN CREATE MORE OPPORTUNITY AND INCREASE THOSE LEVELS OF INCOMES IN IOWA IS BY INCREASING BUSINESS ACTIVITY.

Glover: AND THE GOVERNOR COUNTERS THAT MUCH OF WHAT HE HAS HAD TO DO IN THE LAST THREE AND A HALF YEARS IS BECAUSE THE NATION HAS BEEN IN ECONOMIC RECESSION AND THAT HE'S MANAGED THE BUDGET WITHOUT RAISING TAXES AND BEEN FORCED, IN FACT, TO REDUCE THE SIZE OF GOVERNMENT. HE'LL ARGUE THAT HIS BUDGET THIS YEAR IS SMALLER THAN HIS BUDGET FROM THE FIRST YEAR. HOW DO YOU RESPOND TO THAT?

Gross: WELL, FIRST OF ALL, YOU HAVE TO LOOK AT APPLES TO APPLES. IN THE FIRST THREE AND A HALF YEARS HE'S BEEN GOVERNOR, THE RATE OF STATE SPENDING INCREASED BY 20 TIMES THE RATE OF POPULATION GROWTH IN IOWA, IF YOU LOOK AT APPLES TO APPLES, BECAUSE WHAT HE DOES IS HE BORROWS FROM ALL KINDS OF DIFFERENT FUNDS SO HE SAYS THE GENERAL FUND IS NOT GOING UP. SPENDING HAS INCREASED BY TWO TIMES THE RATE OF INFLATION IN IOWA. WE DON'T HAVE -- WE CAN'T AFFORD TO DO THAT, MIKE. NOW, IN TERMS OF IMPACT ON OUR ECONOMY, THE PROBLEM IS IOWA IS ONE OF THREE STATES IN THE COUNTRY GROWING -- DECLINING MOST RAPIDLY, DECLINING IN POPULATION MOST RAPIDLY SINCE THE YEAR 2000. THAT'S NOT A NATIONAL TREND. THAT'S IOWA, THAT'S NORTH DAKOTA, AND THAT'S WEST VIRGINIA. NOW, WE ARE A LOT BETTER, HAVE TREMENDOUSLY MORE RESOURCES THAN THOSE STATES DO. THERE'S NO REASON WHY WE SHOULD BE DECLINING WHEN THOSE STATES ARE GROWING. AND THE REASON WE'RE NOT IS WE DON'T HAVE LEADERSHIP FOCUSED ON ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT.

Yepsen: MR. GROSS, ANOTHER ISSUE IOWANS ARE CONCERNED ABOUT IS THE ENVIRONMENT, PROTECTING THE ENVIRONMENT, RECREATION. WHAT WOULD YOU DO ABOUT THOSE PROBLEMS?

Gross: DAVID, I HAVE SOME INTERESTING THOUGHTS ABOUT WHAT WE OUGHT TO DO. FIRST OF ALL, ON OUR FARM -- AND DEAN I HAVE TALKED ABOUT THIS BEFORE. WE RAISE REGISTERED POLLED HEREFORDS ON A 450-ACRE FARM SOUTH OF WINTERSET. THE FIRST THING I DID ON THAT FARM WAS PUT IN BUFFER STRIPS AROUND ALL THOSE STREAMS. WE NEED TO DO A MUCH MORE AGGRESSIVE EFFORT OF HAVING BUFFER STRIPS AROUND ALL OUR WATERWAYS. THAT'S PROBABLY ONE THING -- ONE THING WE CAN DO, DAVID, TO HAVE THE MOST POSITIVE, SHORT-TERM IMPACT ON THE QUALITY OF OUR WATERWAYS. WHETHER IT'S COMMERCIAL FERTILIZER OR LIVESTOCK WASTE OR HUMAN WASTE, WE NEED TO HAVE BUFFER STRIPS --

Yepsen: WELL, HOW DO YOU GET THAT DONE?

Gross: THE WAY YOU DO IT, DAVID, IS YOU EDUCATE PEOPLE ABOUT THE INCENTIVES AND THE BENEFITS THAT ARE ALREADY THERE.

Yepsen: BUT, MR. GROSS, EXCUSE ME. WE'VE TALKED ABOUT THAT IN THIS STATE FOR YEARS. IT'S LIKE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT. VOLUNTARY EFFORTS BY FARMERS IN THE RACCOON RIVER WATERSHED WERE SUPPOSED TO DO SOMETHING, AND YET YOU GO DOWN TO THE DES MOINES WATER WORKS AND IT'S RECORD HIGH NITRATES. THOSE BUFFER STRIPS, EITHER THERE AREN'T ENOUGH OF THEM OR THEY'RE NOT WORKING.

Gross: NO, THERE AREN'T ENOUGH OF THEM. DAVID, DRIVE DOWN THE ROAD --

Yepsen: HOW LONG DO WE GIVE AGRICULTURE BEFORE IT DECIDES TO CLEAN UP THE ENVIRONMENT?

Gross: WE NEED TO WORK MORE AGGRESSIVELY WITH AGRICULTURE TO MAKE CERTAIN THAT WE DO BECAUSE AGRICULTURE AND THE ENVIRONMENT CAN AND NEED TO COEXIST IN THIS STATE, AS AGRICULTURE IS A CRITICAL PART OF OUR ECONOMY. WE KNOW THAT AND THERE'S NO REASON WHY IT CAN'T COEXIST. BUFFER STRIPS ARE AN IMPORTANT PART OF THAT, DAVID. WE HAVE TO -- WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO BE MORE AGGRESSIVE WITH THAT. I'LL BE VERY AGGRESSIVE WITH THE AGRICULTURAL COMMUNITY ABOUT DOING THAT. WHEN YOU DRIVE DOWN THE ROADWAYS OF RURAL IOWA AND YOU SEE PEOPLE PLOWING RIGHT UP TO THE EDGE OF THE WATERWAY -- WHICH YOU STILL SEE, WHICH YOU STILL SEE. AT THE SAME TIME YOU KNOW THAT SAME FARMER, DAVID, COULD GET COST-SHARE TO PUT IN THE SWITCH GRASS, COULD GET AN ANNUAL PAYMENT OF CRP TO DEFRAY THE LOSS OF THAT PRODUCTIVITY OF THAT LAND. IT'S JUST BASIC, COMMON ECONOMIC SENSE, AND WE NEED TO GO OUT THERE AND MAKE CERTAIN PEOPLE UNDERSTAND THAT.

Yepsen: SHOULD WE INCREASE THE CRIMINAL PENALTIES ON FARMERS WHO HAVE MANURE SPILLS?

Gross: WELL, I THINK THEY'VE ALREADY INCREASED THE PENALTIES.

Yepsen: I'M TALKING ABOUT CRIMINAL PENALTIES.

Gross: WELL, DAVID, I THINK -- CRIMINAL LAW -- IF YOU'RE FAMILIAR WITH THE LAW -- RELATES TO INTENT. SO IF THERE'S AN INTENT TO POLLUTE, THERE WOULD ALREADY BE CRIMINAL PENALTIES AVAILABLE.

Glover: LET'S BROADEN THE ISSUE JUST A LITTLE BIT, AND LET'S TALK ABOUT THE TENOR OF THE CAMPAIGN THAT WE'RE ABOUT TO WITNESS IN THIS STATE. YOU'VE BEEN BASHING THE GOVERNOR FOR MONTHS. YOU'VE RUN TELEVISION COMMERCIALS THAT SHOW THE DISTORTED PICTURES OF THE GOVERNOR, AND TALK, TALK, TALK. HE'S RUNNING NEGATIVE TELEVISION COMMERCIALS BASHING YOU AND WAS VERY HARSH ON YOU IN HIS ANNOUNCEMENT. WHAT'S THE TENOR OF THE CAMPAIGN WE'RE ABOUT TO SEE?

Gross: WELL, IT'S INTERESTING, THE PRIMARY I JUST MADE IT THROUGH, I HAD TO BEAT THREE CANDIDATES, TWO OF THEM IN MY PARTY AND ONE IN THE OPPOSITE PARTY. FOR THE FIRST TIME IN THE HISTORY OF THE STATE, WE HAD AN INCUMBENT GOVERNOR OF THE OPPOSITE PARTY GET INVOLVED IN OUR PRIMARY RACE ATTACKING ME WITH A VICIOUS ELEVENTH-HOUR ATTACK. IT WAS TOO LATE FOR ME TO EVEN BE ABLE TO RESPOND TO. IT WAS A SNEAK ATTACK BUT IT DIDN'T WORK. IT DIDN'T WORK. MIKE, I'D LIKE TO SEE THE TENOR OF THIS RACE -- I'D LOVE TO SEE THE TENOR OF THIS RACE BE ABOUT THE ISSUES. THAT'S WHY I'VE SUGGESTED WE HAVE FIVE DEBATES AND WE CONCENTRATE THEM ON INDIVIDUAL ISSUES SO WE HAVE TO GET IN DEPTH ON THE ISSUES.

Glover: WILL YOU TAKE A PLEDGE NOT TO RUN ATTACK COMMERCIALS AGAINST THE GOVERNOR?

Gross: WELL, THE PROBLEM IS THE GOVERNOR HAS ALREADY ATTACKED ME. ONE RULE OF LIFE WHEN I WAS GROWING UP IN DEFIANCE, IF SOMEBODY PUNCHED ME IN THE NOSE, I HAD TO PUNCH HIM BACK. [ LAUGHTER ]

Glover: IT'S INEVITABLE, THEN, THAT WE'RE GOING TO HAVE THAT KIND OF A CAMPAIGN.

Gross: WELL, TELL THE GOVERNOR NOT TO PUNCH ME.

Glover: SOMEBODY HAS TO TAKE THE FIRST STEP.

Gross: HE ALREADY TOOK THE FIRST STEP. HE ALREADY PUNCHED ME, MIKE.

Yepsen: MR. GROSS, I WANT TO GO TO -- I WANT TO GO TO AN ISSUE OF YOUR PRIORITIES AS GOVERNOR. FORMER DELAWARE GOVERNOR PETE DUPONT USED TO SAY THAT A GOVERNOR CAN DO ANYTHING HE WANTS, HE JUST CAN'T DO EVERYTHING.

Gross: YEAH, ABSOLUTELY.

Yepsen: SO IF YOU GET ELECTED, WHAT IS THE MOST IMPORTANT THING YOU WANT TO DO AS GOVERNOR?

Gross: GROW THE STATE OF IOWA AGAIN, GROW INCOMES IN IOWA AGAIN. I MEAN, WE'RE 39TH IN THE COUNTRY NOW PER CAPITA INCOME AND DECLINING. OUR RATE OF MANUFACTURING WAGE GROWTH, WHICH USED TO BE VERY HIGH, IS NOW 45TH SLOWEST GROWING. THAT'S WHAT'S HURTING IOWA. IT'S HURTING OUR EDUCATIONAL SYSTEM, OUR HUMAN SERVICES PROBLEMS BECAUSE FAMILIES ARE STRESSED. IT'S HURTING OUR BUDGET. THAT'S WHY OUR BUDGET ISN'T BALANCED. WE HAVE TO AGGRESSIVELY AND FUNDAMENTALLY CHANGE THE ECONOMIC CLIMATE SO WE BECOME A HIGH-INCOME GROWTH STATE AGAIN, DAVID. THAT'S NUMBER ONE. EVERYTHING I DO, DAVID, I WANT TESTED AGAINST THAT STANDARD.

Glover: RUNNING UNDER, IF YOU WILL, ALMOST ALL OF THE NEGATIVES PEOPLE ARE THROWING AT YOU IS A QUESTION OF TRUST. IS DOUG GROSS SOMEONE THAT VOTERS CAN TRUST? HOW CAN YOU MAKE THAT SALE?

Gross: WELL, I MEAN, TALK TO THE PEOPLE WHO HAVE WORKED WITH ME OVER THE YEARS. TALK TO PEOPLE WHO LIVE NEAR ME -- TALK TO THE PEOPLE I'VE WORKED FOR: GOVERNOR RAY, GOVERNOR BRANSTAD, TOM TAUKE, WAYNE RITCHIE. ASK THEM IF DOUG GROSS IS TRUSTWORTHY. THAT'S AN ISSUE, DAVID -- OR, MIKE, THAT I FIND REALLY DISCONCERTING BECAUSE I'VE ALWAYS, ALWAYS FOCUSED ON DOING WHAT I SAID I WAS GOING TO DO WHEN I SAID I WAS GOING TO DO IT. THAT'S REALLY KIND OF A FUNDAMENTAL PHILOSOPHY I'VE LIVED MY LIFE BY.

Borg: BUT IT GOES BACK TO WHAT IS BEING USED IN THE CAMPAIGN AGAINST YOU, AND THAT IS THAT YOU ARE OUT FOR HIRE. THAT IS, CAN -- IF VOTERS ELECT YOU, THEY, IN EVENT, ARE HIRING YOU TO DO THE JOB. BUT IF SOMEONE ELSE HAS CONTRIBUTED A LITTLE BIT MORE, DO YOU SELL YOURSELF TO THEM?

Gross: DEAN, I WOULDN'T HAVE TO BE RUNNING FOR GOVERNOR. I MEAN, I'M SUCCESSFUL IN MY LIFE. OUR FAMILY IS IN GREAT SHAPE. I'M PROUD OF THEM. FRANKLY, FROM A PERSONAL STANDPOINT, IT WOULD BE A LOT EASIER TO SPEND TIME WITH THEM. I'M DOING THIS OUT OF THE BEST OF INTEREST FOR THE STATE. I CARE ABOUT THIS STATE AND I CAN'T BEAR TO SEE WHAT'S HAPPENING TO IT, DEAN. I MEAN, WE ARE NOT THE STATE WE USED TO BE. WE ARE NOT EVEN CLOSE. SO I'M DOING IT OUT OF AN INTEREST OF BEING A PERSON WHO REPRESENTS ALL THE PEOPLE OF IOWA AND THEIR BEST INTEREST. AND I'LL ATTEMPT TO RUN THIS CAMPAIGN, I'LL RUN MY LIFE, AND I'LL RUN MY GOVERNORSHIP THAT WAY.

Yepsen: BACK TO THIS QUESTION OF THE MOST IMPORTANT THING YOU WANT TO TRY TO DO OR ACCOMPLISH AS GOVERNOR; A GOVERNOR HAS POLITICAL CAPITAL HE OR SHE CAN SPEND IN ANY NUMBER OF WAYS. WHAT'S THE ONE THING YOU WOULD LIKE TO SEE IOWANS CHANGE?

Gross: CHANGE?

Yepsen: YEAH.

Gross: I'D LIKE TO SEE US CHANGE OUR ATTITUDE TOWARDS SUCCESS, DAVID. YOU KNOW, WE HAVE SORT OF A LEVELING CULTURE IN IOWA. AND GROWING UP IN RURAL IOWA, YOU KNOW THAT EVEN THE FARMER THAT WAS SUCCESSFUL WAS AFRAID TO DRIVE THAT NEW CAR. PART OF THE REASON FOR THAT IS ALSO BECAUSE WE HAVE A CULTURE THAT WE'RE VERY HUMBLE, AND THAT AGAIN GROWS OUT OF OUR RURAL CULTURE BECAUSE IF YOU BRAGGED ABOUT YOUR CORN CROP, THE NEXT DAY THE WIND WOULD COME AND BLOW IT DOWN. WE JUST HAD THIS SENSE THAT WE DIDN'T CONTROL OUR FUTURE, SO WE WERE VERY CAUTIOUS ABOUT WHAT WE DID. WE NEED TO PROMOTE SUCCESS IN IOWA. WE NEED TO PROMOTE SUCCESS SO WE HAVE MORE OF IT. AND IF I COULD CHANGE THAT ATTITUDE TOWARD SUCCESS, DAVID, I THINK I'D BEING DOING A LOT.

Glover: WHAT DOES THE GOVERNOR DO TO DO THAT?

Gross: I THINK YOU TALK IT UP. YOU PRAISE IT. ALEX HAILEY TALKED A LONG TIME AGO ABOUT WHEN YOU FIND SUCCESS, YOU FIND PEOPLE WHO ARE DOING WELL, AND THEN YOU PRAISE THEM. AND A GOVERNOR -- ONE OF THE BIGGEST POWERS OF THE GOVERNOR'S OFFICE AND THE GOVERNOR HAS IS THE ABILITY TO FOCUS ON ISSUES AND CONTROL THE BULLY PULPIT. IT'S ENORMOUSLY POWERFUL IN OUR STATE. AND IF YOU CAN FIND SUCCESS AND PROMOTE IT OVER AND OVER AGAIN, YOU CAN CHANGE ATTITUDES.

Yepsen: FIFTEEN SECONDS... WHAT'S THE MOST IMPORTANT THING YOU WANT PEOPLE TO REMEMBER ABOUT YOU AS THEY HEAD OFF TO VOTE?

Gross: THAT I -- THAT WHAT THEY NEED IS A LEADER, A LEADER WILLING TO MAKE TOUGH DECISIONS, DAVID, AND DO THE RIGHT THING FOR THE PEOPLE OF IOWA, AND I'LL DO THAT.

Borg: WHAT KIND OF A DEADLINE DO YOU HAVE ON ANNOUNCING YOUR RUNNING MATE?

Gross: OBVIOUSLY, BEFORE THE CONVENTION ON THE 22ND. I HOPE TO ANNOUNCE IT PRIOR TO THE CONVENTION, DEAN, BUT I HAVEN'T DETERMINED THAT YET.

Borg: THANKS, FOR BEING HERE TODAY.

Gross: THANK YOU, DEAN. THANKS, EVERYBODY.

Borg: ON OUR NEXT EDITION OF "IOWA PRESS," WE'LL CONTINUE COVERAGE OF THE RACE FOR GOVERNOR. INCUMBENT TOM VILSACK, THE MAN OUR GUEST HOPES TO DEFEAT, WILL JOIN US TO DISCUSS HIS CAMPAIGN FOR A SECOND TERM AS IOWA'S CHIEF EXECUTIVE. THAT'S NEXT FRIDAY, 6:30; SUNDAY AT NOON. AND THAT'S IT FOR THIS EDITION OF "IOWA PRESS." I'M DEAN BORG. THANKS FOR JOINING US TODAY.

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